Two Countries

[Commissar D, the Evil]

What two countries' support did Germany absolutely have to have in order to go to war? Best Regards, David

[joscha]

Insufficient data. What war? Against Poland, France, the SU? Or is this to be understood as a generic question.

Please elucidate.

[Tom Houlihan]

Well, I suppose it's a given that the German people would have had to support the state for a successful war. Economically, it might have helped if the US had supported Germany, but that wasn't going to happen I guess. If England had been non-belligerent, that might have helped.

[karltrowitz]

If you are talking about going to war in 1939 against Poland (and i'm sure that Hitler knew there was a chance of war against Britain and France),then the answer must be the soviet union and Romania.I say that he at least needed Romania's support because Germany got most of it's oil supplies from there,which he would definately need if a world war broke out.

[sid guttridge]

I'd go with Romania for its oil, leader and army.

I'd go with Italy for its navy, air force and industry.

However, if you want to step outside those countries historically available as allies, Germany's best chance would have been to have the UK neutral. That would have ended any question of a Second Front.

Cheers,

Sid

[Commissar D, the Evil]

My apologies Folks, this was meant to be a Soldatenheim post. But now that it's here, I realize I should have given more information. The question should have been, "What Two Countries Did Germany Absolutely Need to Wage War on the Soviet Union".
Again I apologize for the vagueness of the initial post.
Best Regards and
HAPPY THANKSGIVING
David

[Abwehr]

Romania and Finland.

[Sam H.]

How about "What two countries should Germany have as allies to wage war against Russia?"

For that, I'd go with Japan and Finland.

Now i know, Japan was in no position to attack Russia and the Western allies at the same time. But if she had just lent a hand - say blockading Soviet ports (Vladivostok) and some minor cross-border activity, just to keep the Soviets honest, it would have made a world of diffrence.

Something close to 50% of US Lend-Lease materials went to Russia via the Pacific route, it would not have taken much to block this. And forcing Russia to keep a few divisions in Siberia may have helped in December 1941.

Russia was certainly in no postion to fight a two front war in 1941 or 1942.


Finland would be my second choice, but she would have to be more willing to go beyond her 1939 borders to be a major help. If she refused this, than Romania.

[Commissar D, the Evil]

okay, I'll concede Romania (why not? So did the Rumanians...) because of its status as the only major oil producing country in Europe. But I think you will find the second country a bit difficult. Best Regards, David

[Tom Houlihan]

If you're going to concede Rumania, with precedent, then I'm going to second the motion for Finland. Had they had the drive and ability to force their way into Murmansk, quite a lot of supplies would not have made it to the Ukrainian front. Would it have made a difference? Who knows. Maybe not in the long run, but it sure would have lasted longer!!

[Commissar D, the Evil]

Hi Tom, my thinking is that without Czechoslovakia's AFV industry, Germany could never have hung on as long as it did. True, the Finns were tough fighters, but they didn't have the manpower to push much further into Russia.
On the other hand, Czech vehicles, the T-38, the Marder series, the Hetzers numbered in the thousands over the course of the war.
Best Regards, David

[Tom Houlihan]

Okay, I'll accept the need for the Czech AFVs. Mayhap I misunderstood the original question. I thought it referred to allies and supporters. I think the support the Czechs gave the Reich in the instance of the AFVs was probably a little less than willing!! One can't argue the fact that Czech-built armor certainly filled many wholes in the ranks throughout the war. The Germans were very good at using captured material for their own forces. One could almost say in some cases that they used it more effectively than the original owners!!

[Commissar D, the Evil]

Hi Tom, well...okay, I could have phrased the question better. But I wanted to see what people would come up with. It's frightening to think that Rumania was indispensible.
But the size of Czechoslovakia's contribution to the German war machine shouldn't go un-noticed because the Protectorate wasn't an ally. Indeed, for an occupied country, the Czechoslovakians really produced! Best Regards, David

[Wolfkin]

Hmmmm....how about what three countries? I am having a tough time choosing between Romania, Czechoslovakia and Finland.

Cheers,

Wolfkin

[Commissar D, the Evil]

Hi Wolfkin, don't get me wrong, the Finns were tough fighters, but I don't think they were essential to Germany's war against Russia. What did they do besides blockade the northern sector of Leningrad? Really, Hungary contributed more in terms of troops that could be employed inside of Russia. What do you think? Best Regards, David