Hallo All.
Can somebody help me and answer a question:
During the operation Citadel (July 1943) Bef.Pz III were armed with the real gun or wooden gun? or some Bef.Pz. III were armed with real gun?
I am interested by the information about Bef.Pz. in all Pz. and Pz.Gren Divisions (incl. Waffen SS), participating in a Citadel.
Sole, that I know - in 3 Pz.D before the beginning of operation Citadel was only 1 Bef.Pz.III, therefore 4 linear Pz. III were altered in Bef.Pz.
And in 7 Pz.D were 7 Bef.Pz. III with 5 cm Kwk L/60.
Best regards,
Panzeralex
Bef.Pz. III during operation Citadel
Moderator: sniper1shot
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Panzeralex
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Pz Bef Wagen III in July 1943
How the PzBef Wagen III was armed depended on the model. The Sd Kfz 266-268 series were the machine gun armed version based on the Ausf. D, E, and H. The Sd Kfz 141 was based on the Ausf. J chassis and the 50mm L60 was the Ausf. K.
Model Years built Numbers built Armament
Sd Kfz 266-268 6/1938-1/1942 250 machine gun
Sd Kfz 141 (new) 8/1942-11/1942 81 50mm L42
Sd Kfz 141 3/1943-9/1943 104 50mm L42
(conversion from Pz III)
Pz Bef Wg Ausf. K 12/1942-3/1943 50 50mm L60
All the Pz Bef Wagen were used until the end of the war. The earlier models were phased out by the process of attrition. The table below shows the number of Pz Bef Wagen in each division on 1 Juli 1943 for Citadel.
Division PzBef
2 Pz 6
3 Pz 1
4 Pz 6
5 Pz 9
6 Pz 6
7 Pz 7
8 Pz 6
9 Pz 6
11 Pz 4
12 Pz 4
13 Pz 2
17 Pz 2
18 Pz 3
19 Pz 3
20 Pz 7
23 Pz 1
16 Pz Gren 1
GD 8
LSSAH 9
Das Reich 10
Totenkopf 9
Wiking 1
Source: Panzertruppen and Encylopedia of German Tanks by Jentz
Model Years built Numbers built Armament
Sd Kfz 266-268 6/1938-1/1942 250 machine gun
Sd Kfz 141 (new) 8/1942-11/1942 81 50mm L42
Sd Kfz 141 3/1943-9/1943 104 50mm L42
(conversion from Pz III)
Pz Bef Wg Ausf. K 12/1942-3/1943 50 50mm L60
All the Pz Bef Wagen were used until the end of the war. The earlier models were phased out by the process of attrition. The table below shows the number of Pz Bef Wagen in each division on 1 Juli 1943 for Citadel.
Division PzBef
2 Pz 6
3 Pz 1
4 Pz 6
5 Pz 9
6 Pz 6
7 Pz 7
8 Pz 6
9 Pz 6
11 Pz 4
12 Pz 4
13 Pz 2
17 Pz 2
18 Pz 3
19 Pz 3
20 Pz 7
23 Pz 1
16 Pz Gren 1
GD 8
LSSAH 9
Das Reich 10
Totenkopf 9
Wiking 1
Source: Panzertruppen and Encylopedia of German Tanks by Jentz
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Panzeralex
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Kamen Nevenkin
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I need to correct the information posted by jhalcli - in fact only SdKfz 265 was armed with machine gun. The rest of the series (266, 267, 268) were designated in accordance with their radio sets. For example, there were PzIII/SdKfz 267, Panthers/SdKfz 267 and Tigers/SdKfz 267, but all of them were equipped with FuG 5 + FuG 8 combination.
Kamen
Kamen
Re: Bef.Pz. III during operation Citadel
Should Pz Bef III be considered as AFV by German ?