8th hussars destruction during Gazala battle and cold engine

[Eduard]

Hi,

8th Hussars from 4th armoured brigade was nearly destroyed during the first day of the gazala battle.

ASFIK The light squadron equipped with Stuarts reacted to the menace advancing to the prepared positions but meet frontally DAK panzers in masse and had to retire trough both Grant squadrons.

The Grant squadrons, they said, were not able to move from their leagueer because their engines weren't hot enough to start and most if not all of them were destroyed in place.

Can this be? How long did take to start a Grant engine and be able to move?


Does anyone know if there were survivors? I mean Grants that were able to escape?

Thanks Eduard

[David W]

Grants employed air-cooled rotary engines. A feature of a rotary is 'hydrostatic lock' occuring when an engine has been stationary for a while and unspent fluid has leaked into the bottom cylinders.There were nineteen stages in the Grants starting procedure, including inserting a long crank handle into the engine for two men to turn until the lock was evident, the sparking plugs were then removed for draining.

From my mate Brian.

[Eduard]

do you know how long it take?

and the crew had to be outside the tank?

thanks

Eduard

[David W]

Eduard.

The short answer is that I don't know!

To compound matters further, Brian, the guy who gave me the info I posted above, has just gone into hospital. So join me in wishing him a speedy recovery and I'll forward your questions to him upon his return. (God willing).

[C.GILLONO]

Hi!
Before posting I watched a short video of the same sequence on a Sexton I shot at the latest Tanks in Town in Mons this summer.
The crew is outside at rear (look at the upper rear plate of any radial engined US Medium and you will see the entry hole for the handle) and turns it during 20 to 30 s.
One man can do it.

HTH

[Magnus]

Hello all.

Found this check list for the starting procedure of the Grant tank. It is included in a book called "All tanked up..." by John Owen Smith, link to this can be found at the bottom of the post.

Hope it helps a bit.

• * 1. Make sure that the master switch and ignition switch are 'off' and that the gear lever is in neutral.
  * 2. Check the level of the engine oil by the dipstick on the filter cap of the oil tank
  (do not overfill).
  * 3. Inspect the engine compartment for loose and missing parts.
  * 4. If engine has been stationery for five hours or more it must be turned by the starting handle over at least eight compressions (to check for a Hydrostatic Lock).
  If a lock is evident, remove spark plugs from lower cylinders to pump oil out.
  * 5. Check the transmission and final driver for oil.
  * 6. Check the voltmeter: it should read zero.
  * 7. Close the master switch and the voltmeter should read 24 volts.
  * 8. Turn on the required petrol tanks.
  * 9. Turn on HYCON pressure cock and check for leaks.
  * 10. Prime engine if necessary (not more than four pumps).
  * 11. Check clearance of the clutch pedal and then depress it.
  * 12. Close starter and booster switches together.
  * 13. Let the engine turn for a short while then switch the magnetos on to 'Both'.
  NOTE:- Do not prime engine whilst it is turning or switched on.
  * 14. Check oil pressure gauge: should read between 60-80 lbs per sq. in.
  (If the oil fails to show within 45 seconds, switch off the engine).
  * 15. Check the flow of the gearbox oil by the tap situated at radiator.
  * 16. Check for leaks throughout the engine and transmission.
  * 17. Check the running of the engine on each of the magnetos.
  * 18. Let the engine warm up before moving the tank.
  (The minimum oil temperature should be 80 degrees to 100 degrees).
  * 19. Do not attempt to move off until engine has warmed up for at least 10 minutes.

Link to the list and the book can be found here:
http://www.johnowensmith.co.uk/grantst.htm

[phylo_roadking]

All, regarding the above complicated starting procedure - note the hand-turning over on the crank and the letting the oil warm; remember that after a typical FREEZING desert night, engine/sump oil and tranny oil would both be a lot thicker and more turgid than in temperate European conditions, and the handcranking up onto compression would be both slower and require more hands on the crankrod, and the warming-up period to both full oil pressure and minimum operating temperature would be longer. Add all THAT together and you could add a precious five or ten minutes to the whole affair.

[Eduard]

Well,

Comming again to this topic.

Well I guess that after being put on orders to move it took the grant's squadrons about 15-20 minutes to start to move.

If the german tanks were advancing their speed would be about 18km/h (i'm not sure about this) so they had covered between 4,5 to 6 km

pretty a disadvantage this slow time to get moving....

Do you know what time took to the M3 Stuart to do the same...?

Eduard