It seems to me that leaving people alone and minding our own business (and defending our own border) is the sane way to do business.
I agree with you unfortunately the world is a much more complicated
than just taking care of "our own". The western world and for that
matter Europe runs on imports and that makes the situation
difficult IMHO. What is going on "over there" directly affects
our daily lives.
Thats the rub: oil is a legitimate national interest.
How about this for a solution? The US ends all aid funding for Israel and withdraws all forces from Korea, the PI, and the Middle East, and annexes as soverign US soil several miles of northwestern Kuwait or the country of Qatar, building massive defenses around either and securing the shipping lanes through the Strait of Hormuz. Any locals there wil be granted US citizenship or paid off handsomely to head elsewhere. The US also renounces all interventions in the Mideast and around the world and the troops come home, to be placed on the southern border at Ft Irwin, Ft Huachuca, Ft Bliss, and Ft Hood.
Getting back to Hicks. There is of course the possibility that his country let him down before he ever decided to go to Afghanistan and it's simply continuing along that road.
I agree with my fellow Australian, if he is guilty punish him. However don't make him a show pony for Bush's political benefit.
As for Iraq, if they have in the US zone to put up with just a fraction of the bullshit we had to put up with during Cheney's recent visit, no wonder they get slightly annoyed.
- Hans
Was haben wir für dich gewollt
Du deutsches Vaterland?
- H Gehr IR 21./17.ID
What a wanker chicken-hawk Cheney is! Why would you need a 35 car motorcade! Really, 35 cars! I'd really like someone here who is familiar with Whitehouse security to explain that one to me. When President Clinton came here, he didn't need 35 cars, so why does dead-eye Dick?
pzrmeyer2 sounds like a better plan then the Bush Admin of Command and Conquer. Though I don't get how people think this war has to do with oil price of oil in the US has just skyrocketed and its not like Iraq had oilfields worth fighting over...Saudi Arabia, yes...Iraq, no.
Hans, I love how the country failed him. Bloody hell has society gone down the sh*tter so fast that we no longer have personal responsibility? I swear to the good Lord if I hear another idiot spout off or get caught molesting children and blame it on alcoholism I will blow a blood vessel! Today's society is about passing the buck no one ever owns up to making their mistakes it is always some power out of their control that caused them to go on a shotgun rampage wasting 20 people or some such nonsense. Though thanks for the reminder Hans that becoming a terrorist is to be blamed on "the meanies" instead of personal responsibility.
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.
I'm the last person to suggest that a person should not take responsibility for his or her actions. However that applies to everyone, from the top down. There used to be such a thing as ministerial responsibility in this country. That went west with the water years ago. Now every politician blames everybody else for his/her being stupid and a liar. Not a good example for the hoi poloi.
Anyway what sort of a legal system locks up a bloke and then can't figure out what to charge him with. If he is guilty of something he was guilty of it when he was caught and justice could have been meted out if not immediatelly, within days. As he has not had his day in court, one has to assume that there is something wrong with the system.
As for calling him a terrorist. Hell, he don't frighten me none, and I've been terrorised by experts.
- Hans
Was haben wir für dich gewollt
Du deutsches Vaterland?
- H Gehr IR 21./17.ID
"he don't frighten me none, and I've been terrorised by experts."
Spot on. I've fought terrorist in a war and they didn't scare - I'm much more afraid of the govt wankers than I am an half baked jihadist with an attitude.
General
Re Cheney's motorcode
When Clinton visited China it cost us 35 million dollars - he took several THOUSAND people with him in a fleet of planes.
That's why I weary of Bush bashing. These bums are all the same - they think they are some sort of aristocracy.
Hi Reb, I don't know about Clinton's China visit, but I'm sure he didn't bring thousands of people here when he came, I may be wrong. Still, what did Cheney need 35 cars for? Are they full of Secret Service guys or marines or what? Maybe that's normal over there, but it's a lot over here. When they blocked off the harbour bridge, it was a veritable motorcade, AND DAMNED ANNOYING!
I understand your annoyance. Clinton came to Atlanta a couple times, and Bush after him, disrupting traffic and causing thousands of people major inconvenience. (I'm guessing the motorcade is to confuse assasins)
If they are so important they can't go anywhere without all that bullshit then my advice is just stay home!
btw - when I was young and dumb I worked as a bodyguard - or personal protection operative I think we called it at that time. And I found most of the folks I protected a) had brought trouble on themselves through bad behavior; or b) wanted the prestige of having personal protection - it made them feel important! I think with the politicos its a combination of both.
And a sad reminder - evening during our War for Southern Independence, neither Jeff Davis nor Abe Lincoln had more than one bodyguard - usually a simple soldier or a friend with a pocket pistol. Public access to them was expected.
When Queen "Elizabeth" went to Kanada it cost the
Canadian people lots of money. Not only the government
but the people with inconvenience. Even manhole covers
had to be welded closed and tops of buildings guarded and covered
but the list goes on and on. Its easy to see how much
money was spent. Of course there are a few people
whom love Royalty and would not mind the money spent.
Not any different with Presidents. I think it all changed
when President Kennedy was shot.
These bums are all the same - they think they are some sort of aristocracy
They are, really they are!!!!
Recently I came across a familytree of the Bush family that tied them in to the British Royals and through them to the Normans, the de Medici's, Julius Caesar, Alexander the Great and King Nebukhadnezar. Among a host of other high and mighties of days gone by. LMAO.
If that ain't royal I don't know what is.
And Bush is related to Kerry too!!! And Cheney and the Kennedy's and the Roosevelts and......
When President Clinton came here, he didn't need 35 cars, so why does dead-eye Dick?
ummm....more people hate him?
Though I don't get how people think this war has to do with oil price of oil in the US has just skyrocketed and its not like Iraq had oilfields worth fighting over...Saudi Arabia, yes...Iraq, no.
Its not about having it...its about having it and controlling the supply The U.S. people control NOTHING, U.S.-owned companies do!
P.S. the world's largest, known and unexploited oil reserve is actually...right under downtown Bagdahd!!! The technology for directional drilling was too new in the early 1990's when Gulf War One kicked off, and up until then Saddam had refused permission to Western companies to make ANY attempt to tap that oilfiel. Now....its a very different ballgame.
"Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." - Malcolm Reynolds
evening during our War for Southern Independence, neither Jeff Davis nor Abe Lincoln had more than one bodyguard - usually a simple soldier or a friend with a pocket pistol. Public access to them was expected.
Generalderpanzertruppen wrote:What a wanker chicken-hawk Cheney is! Why would you need a 35 car motorcade! Really, 35 cars! I'd really like someone here who is familiar with Whitehouse security to explain that one to me. When President Clinton came here, he didn't need 35 cars, so why does dead-eye Dick?
perhaps because of the uncivilized means of protest that your ideological allies display. knocking down barricades, violence, threats, etc. And how about if a recently relesed Mr Hicks deceided to walk up and detonate the bomb belt he was wearing? Are those civilized forms of dissent?
Though I don't get how people think this war has to do with oil price of oil in the US has just skyrocketed and its not like Iraq had oilfields worth fighting over...Saudi Arabia, yes...Iraq, no.
