when op luttich,17SS use a Kampfgruppe with Das Reich to move though Mortain and attack to the west and southwest, So I want to know the oder of battle obout 17SS in this time.
Thanks and forgive my poor English
i need info about 17SS in mortain
i need info about 17SS in mortain
just like waffen-ss
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Martin Block
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Re: i need info about 17SS in mortain
On 5.8.1944 the 17. SS-Pz.Gren.Div. reported the following combat strength:
Kampfstärke am 5.8.1944:
a) Kampfgruppe Fick:
Stab = 5 Führer (officers) / 12 Unterführer (NCOs) / 64 Mannschaften (ORs)
I./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 37 = 4 / 11 / 57
13./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 37 = 1 / 5 / 24
14./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 37 = 1 / 2 / 37
I./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 38 = 1 / 4 / 25
SS-Pz.Aufkl.Abt. 17 =3 / 3 / 28
Fallsch.Jg.Rgt. 14 = 3 / 8 / 11
Ersatz (replacements) = 1 / 7 / 40
I.K.H.-Zug (infantry gun platoon) = 0 / 2 / 16
Total for Kgr. Fick = 19 / 54 / 302
b) Artillerie-Gruppe Ernst:
Stab = 3 / 8 / 15
I./SS-Art.Rgt. 17 = 8 / 25 / 170
7./SS-Art.Rgt. 17 = 2 / 5 / 44
8./SS-Art.Rgt. 17 = 2 / 5 / 47
Stab III./SS-Art.Rgt. 17 = 3 / 5 / 39
Total for Art.Grp. Ernst = 18 / 48 / 318
c.) SS-Pi.Btl. 17 = 1 / 11 / 64
Total combat strength 17. SS-Pz.Gren.Div. = 38 / 113 / 684
By 7.8.1944 this had been reduced to
Total for Kgr. Fick = 20 / 46 / 290 (now including SS-Pi.Btl. 17 and a Pz.Jg.Zug (Sf.))
Total for Art.Grp. Ernst = 18 / 52 / 320
Total combat strength 17. SS-Pz.Gren.Div. = 38 / 98 / 610
The number of weapons is not given is this particular report but from the divisional report dated 1.8.1944 one can estimate that
a.) Kampfgruppe Fick may have had available at maximum about 2-3 7,62 I.K.H. 290 (r), 3-4 le. and s.I.G., 1 or 2 Marder III (7,5 cm), and a few 5 cm Pak 38 and 2 cm Flak 28 each.
b) Artillerie-Gruppe Ernst may have had available at maximum some 10 le.F.H. 18, 9 s.F.H., 1 10 cm K 18 if all guns were still combat ready.
SS-Pz.Abt. 17 had none of its StuG IV combat ready any more and SS-Pz.Jg.Abt. 17 had not yet arrived. Armored support for Kampfgruppe Fick came from SS-Pz.Jg.Abt. 2 which had to supply 1 StuG III company for the attack. How strong that company actually was is unknown to me.
All information comes from documents which can be found in the war diary of 17. SS-Pz.Gren.Div.
Martin Block
Kampfstärke am 5.8.1944:
a) Kampfgruppe Fick:
Stab = 5 Führer (officers) / 12 Unterführer (NCOs) / 64 Mannschaften (ORs)
I./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 37 = 4 / 11 / 57
13./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 37 = 1 / 5 / 24
14./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 37 = 1 / 2 / 37
I./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 38 = 1 / 4 / 25
SS-Pz.Aufkl.Abt. 17 =3 / 3 / 28
Fallsch.Jg.Rgt. 14 = 3 / 8 / 11
Ersatz (replacements) = 1 / 7 / 40
I.K.H.-Zug (infantry gun platoon) = 0 / 2 / 16
Total for Kgr. Fick = 19 / 54 / 302
b) Artillerie-Gruppe Ernst:
Stab = 3 / 8 / 15
I./SS-Art.Rgt. 17 = 8 / 25 / 170
7./SS-Art.Rgt. 17 = 2 / 5 / 44
8./SS-Art.Rgt. 17 = 2 / 5 / 47
Stab III./SS-Art.Rgt. 17 = 3 / 5 / 39
Total for Art.Grp. Ernst = 18 / 48 / 318
c.) SS-Pi.Btl. 17 = 1 / 11 / 64
Total combat strength 17. SS-Pz.Gren.Div. = 38 / 113 / 684
By 7.8.1944 this had been reduced to
Total for Kgr. Fick = 20 / 46 / 290 (now including SS-Pi.Btl. 17 and a Pz.Jg.Zug (Sf.))
Total for Art.Grp. Ernst = 18 / 52 / 320
Total combat strength 17. SS-Pz.Gren.Div. = 38 / 98 / 610
The number of weapons is not given is this particular report but from the divisional report dated 1.8.1944 one can estimate that
a.) Kampfgruppe Fick may have had available at maximum about 2-3 7,62 I.K.H. 290 (r), 3-4 le. and s.I.G., 1 or 2 Marder III (7,5 cm), and a few 5 cm Pak 38 and 2 cm Flak 28 each.
b) Artillerie-Gruppe Ernst may have had available at maximum some 10 le.F.H. 18, 9 s.F.H., 1 10 cm K 18 if all guns were still combat ready.
SS-Pz.Abt. 17 had none of its StuG IV combat ready any more and SS-Pz.Jg.Abt. 17 had not yet arrived. Armored support for Kampfgruppe Fick came from SS-Pz.Jg.Abt. 2 which had to supply 1 StuG III company for the attack. How strong that company actually was is unknown to me.
All information comes from documents which can be found in the war diary of 17. SS-Pz.Gren.Div.
Martin Block