Heydrich's Storch
Heydrich's Storch
In an otherwise seemingly accurately-researched film, 'Conspiracy' (about the Wansee meeting), Heydrich is shown arriving flying a Fiesler Storch, with swastikas on its wings. With such attention to detail on the actors' uniforms, etc., it seems an unlikely sort of mistake to have made with the aeroplane's markings. Any aircraft enthusiast, in particular the modern-day owner of that Storch, certainly wouldn't make such an error. So.... was it an error, or did Heydrich's Storch really have swastikas on its wingtips?? If so... why? Does anyone know the answer to this one?
Ludicrous!
Now thousands of people who saw the film will spend the rest of their lives believing that the Luftwaffe (remember: if it flew, it belonged to the Luftwaffe) painted the Hakenkreuz on the wings of the planes in lieu of the Balkenkreuz. And all because some film-making idiots didn't do their research. Marvellous.
Now thousands of people who saw the film will spend the rest of their lives believing that the Luftwaffe (remember: if it flew, it belonged to the Luftwaffe) painted the Hakenkreuz on the wings of the planes in lieu of the Balkenkreuz. And all because some film-making idiots didn't do their research. Marvellous.
I can't believe that it was a research 'mistake'; I mean whoever owned the Storch was bound to have known what markings a Luftwaffe aircraft would have had, and the research team was good enough to come up with very accurate uniforms and insignia. So, it was either a deliberate decision to use swastikas, or Heydrich's Storch really did sport swastikas on its wings. If the former, why the deliberate decision? If the latter, why would Heydrich's Storch carry such unusual markings?
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phylo_roadking
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Hi, would assume that if IF its NOT a mistake then.....would Heydrich have a privately-owned SS aircraft? As opposed to being flown about by the Luftwaffe? Just a guess, but youre right, in an otherwise impeccable film about what is lets face it an incredible topic to make a film about, it would be an amazing mistake. I mean, despite the deep historical interest in such a topic, its hard to make a film about a "business meeting" such compelling viewing; a "bad" job done well, as they say. The better for yes the quality of EVERYTHING else except this one thing.
phylo
phylo
Gentlemen, all I can say is the following:
1) I've been researching the Luftwaffe since 1965 when I was introduced to my first issue of Royal Air Force Flying Review while stationed on a Canadian RCAF base near Baden Baden in SW Germany. In all those 41 years of trawling my way through archives in the U.S., Germany and Britain, and buying more than 1,200 books on the Luftwaffe and subscribing over time to several dozen magazines and journals on the subject, I have never seen a Fieseler Storch or any other German-operated aircraft with the Hakenkreuz on the wings. There were Finnish aircraft of German manufacture with the Hakenkreuz on the wings, but not German.
2) This subject concerning the aircraft flown by Reinhard Heydrich has come up a number of times on http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/ and on http://forum.axishistory.com/index.php, and I would imagine on other Luftwaffe-oriented web sites, too, such as http://www.luftwaffe-experten.org/forums/. To the best of my recollection, there has been no mention of a Storch with the Hakenkreuz on the wings. There were some really, really knowledgeable people participating in these discussions, too.
3) Given that I am a firm believer in the principal that "anything is possible", especially when it comes to World War II with its 50-million players operating several million tanks, aircraft and ships over a 68-month period of time. So I could be wrong and I will certainly allow for the possibility that Heydrich, perhaps for a week as a joke or whatever, flew himself around in a Storch with swastikas painted on the wings. But where is the evidence? Where are the photo(s)? Where is the research? A fellow from the Netherlands who has Heydrich as a pilot as his principal interest was one of the participants in the forum discussions noted above. He has over 20+ years collected every scrap of information and every photo of Heydrich with airplanes, yet I do not believe he said anything about this alleged Storch. So, if this is really, really bugging you guys, then get researching and report your findings back here so we can all benefit from what you have learned.
Cheers,
--Lorenz
1) I've been researching the Luftwaffe since 1965 when I was introduced to my first issue of Royal Air Force Flying Review while stationed on a Canadian RCAF base near Baden Baden in SW Germany. In all those 41 years of trawling my way through archives in the U.S., Germany and Britain, and buying more than 1,200 books on the Luftwaffe and subscribing over time to several dozen magazines and journals on the subject, I have never seen a Fieseler Storch or any other German-operated aircraft with the Hakenkreuz on the wings. There were Finnish aircraft of German manufacture with the Hakenkreuz on the wings, but not German.
2) This subject concerning the aircraft flown by Reinhard Heydrich has come up a number of times on http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/ and on http://forum.axishistory.com/index.php, and I would imagine on other Luftwaffe-oriented web sites, too, such as http://www.luftwaffe-experten.org/forums/. To the best of my recollection, there has been no mention of a Storch with the Hakenkreuz on the wings. There were some really, really knowledgeable people participating in these discussions, too.
3) Given that I am a firm believer in the principal that "anything is possible", especially when it comes to World War II with its 50-million players operating several million tanks, aircraft and ships over a 68-month period of time. So I could be wrong and I will certainly allow for the possibility that Heydrich, perhaps for a week as a joke or whatever, flew himself around in a Storch with swastikas painted on the wings. But where is the evidence? Where are the photo(s)? Where is the research? A fellow from the Netherlands who has Heydrich as a pilot as his principal interest was one of the participants in the forum discussions noted above. He has over 20+ years collected every scrap of information and every photo of Heydrich with airplanes, yet I do not believe he said anything about this alleged Storch. So, if this is really, really bugging you guys, then get researching and report your findings back here so we can all benefit from what you have learned.
Cheers,
--Lorenz
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Tom Houlihan
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It wouldn't surprise me in the least if the SS had a few aircraft that belonged to them, not Onkel Hermann. Hell, they had their own private army! What's a couple more planes?
Now, if one follows that assumption, then what other symbol would be on the wings of an SS bird? Not the runes, that'd be tacky.
It's probably an error on the part of the props guy in the film, but I have to agree with Lorenz. Too many things happened that were "against the rules!"
Now, if one follows that assumption, then what other symbol would be on the wings of an SS bird? Not the runes, that'd be tacky.
It's probably an error on the part of the props guy in the film, but I have to agree with Lorenz. Too many things happened that were "against the rules!"
Aircraft duty flight/air taxi services for Himmler, Heydrich and gang were provided by the following unit:
[extractions]
Fliegerstaffel des Führers (F.d.F.)
(Unit Code: factory codes were used exclusively)
also as: Regierungsflugdienst
Flugbereitschaft RLM
Regierungsstaffel
Staffel Baur
Formation and Early History. (Feb 33 - Aug 39)
The Staffel’s orgin dates back to February 1933 when Adolf Hitler directed Lufthansa Flugkapitän Hans Baur, who was already the Führer’s personal pilot, to establish a Regierungsflugdienst (Government Flight Service) at Berlin-Tempelhof with 2 Ju 52/3m ce transports. In 1934, and now with 4 Ju 52s on hand, it was officially designated Flugbereitschaft RLM but informally referred to as Regierungsstaffel. By 31 December 1936 the Regierungsstaffel had grown to 13 Ju 52s, two of which were reserved for Hitler’s use, 3 for General Göring’s use and 7 of the remainder assigned to Hess, Himmler, Rippentrop and several other high officials. The first Fw 200 Condor was delivered to the Staffel in July 1939 and a specially outfitted Condor (D-2600 “Immelmann III”) for Hitler’s use was delivered on 19 October 1939. Through its existence from 1933 to 1945 the Staffel’s sole function was to operate as a private passenger airline for Hitler and the highest ranking personages of the National Socialist regime and foreign heads of state on official visits to the Führer. At no time during its existence did the Staffel belong to the Luftwaffe. Instead, it came directly under the Reichskanzlei and the Führer’s personal military staff. The aircrew personnel and other senior officials were former Deutsche Lufthansa (DLH) employees who held honorary rank in the SS and wore high-ranking SS uniforms. The remaining personnel were a mixture of DLH civilians and after the war began a smattering of carefully selected Luftwaffe personnel. During the early war years Hans Baur created a Staffel emblem that consisted of an eagle’s head with a surrounding oak wreath or crown and the inscription “F.d.F.” The Regierungsstaffel was renamed Fliegerstaffel des Führers on or about 1 September 1939.
Jul 41: the Kurierstaffel des Führers, which belong to the Luftwaffe, became a component of F.d.F but retained its separate identity. The Kurierstaffel operated mainly between Hitler’s command bunker at Rastenburg and Berlin with a small number of aircraft and transported orders, directives, plans and lesser civilian and military officials. Several other similar units were also eventually incorporated into F.d.F.: Flugbereitschaft des Auswärtige Amt, Kurierstaffel des Auswärtige Amt, and the duty flights and courier squadrons of OKW, OKM, Reichsminister Todt and the Reichsführer SS.
For published references see:
C.G.Sweeting-Hitler’s Squadron: The Fuehrer’s Personal Aircraft and Transport Unit, 1933-45.
K.Kössler/G.Ott-Die großen Dessauer: Junkers Ju 89, Ju 90, Ju 290, Ju 390 – Die Geschichte einer Flugzeugfamilie.
Jet & Prop magazine, Heft (issue) 3/1995 and 4/1995.
Dozens and dozens of photos, but none of the alleged Storch.
--Lorenz
[extractions]
Fliegerstaffel des Führers (F.d.F.)
(Unit Code: factory codes were used exclusively)
also as: Regierungsflugdienst
Flugbereitschaft RLM
Regierungsstaffel
Staffel Baur
Formation and Early History. (Feb 33 - Aug 39)
The Staffel’s orgin dates back to February 1933 when Adolf Hitler directed Lufthansa Flugkapitän Hans Baur, who was already the Führer’s personal pilot, to establish a Regierungsflugdienst (Government Flight Service) at Berlin-Tempelhof with 2 Ju 52/3m ce transports. In 1934, and now with 4 Ju 52s on hand, it was officially designated Flugbereitschaft RLM but informally referred to as Regierungsstaffel. By 31 December 1936 the Regierungsstaffel had grown to 13 Ju 52s, two of which were reserved for Hitler’s use, 3 for General Göring’s use and 7 of the remainder assigned to Hess, Himmler, Rippentrop and several other high officials. The first Fw 200 Condor was delivered to the Staffel in July 1939 and a specially outfitted Condor (D-2600 “Immelmann III”) for Hitler’s use was delivered on 19 October 1939. Through its existence from 1933 to 1945 the Staffel’s sole function was to operate as a private passenger airline for Hitler and the highest ranking personages of the National Socialist regime and foreign heads of state on official visits to the Führer. At no time during its existence did the Staffel belong to the Luftwaffe. Instead, it came directly under the Reichskanzlei and the Führer’s personal military staff. The aircrew personnel and other senior officials were former Deutsche Lufthansa (DLH) employees who held honorary rank in the SS and wore high-ranking SS uniforms. The remaining personnel were a mixture of DLH civilians and after the war began a smattering of carefully selected Luftwaffe personnel. During the early war years Hans Baur created a Staffel emblem that consisted of an eagle’s head with a surrounding oak wreath or crown and the inscription “F.d.F.” The Regierungsstaffel was renamed Fliegerstaffel des Führers on or about 1 September 1939.
Jul 41: the Kurierstaffel des Führers, which belong to the Luftwaffe, became a component of F.d.F but retained its separate identity. The Kurierstaffel operated mainly between Hitler’s command bunker at Rastenburg and Berlin with a small number of aircraft and transported orders, directives, plans and lesser civilian and military officials. Several other similar units were also eventually incorporated into F.d.F.: Flugbereitschaft des Auswärtige Amt, Kurierstaffel des Auswärtige Amt, and the duty flights and courier squadrons of OKW, OKM, Reichsminister Todt and the Reichsführer SS.
For published references see:
C.G.Sweeting-Hitler’s Squadron: The Fuehrer’s Personal Aircraft and Transport Unit, 1933-45.
K.Kössler/G.Ott-Die großen Dessauer: Junkers Ju 89, Ju 90, Ju 290, Ju 390 – Die Geschichte einer Flugzeugfamilie.
Jet & Prop magazine, Heft (issue) 3/1995 and 4/1995.
Dozens and dozens of photos, but none of the alleged Storch.
--Lorenz
Here's another possibility:
Fliegergruppe z.b.V. 7 was an expansion and reorganization of the Polizeifliegerabteilung of the Ordnungspolizei which had existed in various forms since the World War I period to patrol Germany’s borders, regulate highway and river traffic, spot and fight forest fires and other natural disasters, courier documents and mail, and to transport senior police officials. The Abteilung was very small by any measure, only consisting of 9 aircraft on 28 May 1940, nearly all of which in Berlin or Poland. The personnel were police who had received training at Luftwaffe schools, and for administrative and pay purposes belonged to the Luftwaffe from July 1942. The KStN (TO&E) for each Staffel of Fliegergruppe z.b.V. 7 called for 1 multi-engine courier/liaison plane (Ju 52, Si 104/204, Fw 58, etc.), 7 Fi 156 (one of which was outfitted for medical-evacuation work) and 1 glider. The Fw 189 appears to have been used also, mainly in Russia.
Source:
[Flugzeug Magazine-Flugzeug-Dokumentation Nr. 4 (Polizeiflieger), 1995.
Again, no mention of the Heydrich Storch with Hakenkreuzen on the wings.
--Lorenz
Fliegergruppe z.b.V. 7 was an expansion and reorganization of the Polizeifliegerabteilung of the Ordnungspolizei which had existed in various forms since the World War I period to patrol Germany’s borders, regulate highway and river traffic, spot and fight forest fires and other natural disasters, courier documents and mail, and to transport senior police officials. The Abteilung was very small by any measure, only consisting of 9 aircraft on 28 May 1940, nearly all of which in Berlin or Poland. The personnel were police who had received training at Luftwaffe schools, and for administrative and pay purposes belonged to the Luftwaffe from July 1942. The KStN (TO&E) for each Staffel of Fliegergruppe z.b.V. 7 called for 1 multi-engine courier/liaison plane (Ju 52, Si 104/204, Fw 58, etc.), 7 Fi 156 (one of which was outfitted for medical-evacuation work) and 1 glider. The Fw 189 appears to have been used also, mainly in Russia.
Source:
[Flugzeug Magazine-Flugzeug-Dokumentation Nr. 4 (Polizeiflieger), 1995.
Again, no mention of the Heydrich Storch with Hakenkreuzen on the wings.
--Lorenz
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Doktor Krollspell
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Hello Lorenz!
Let me first thank you for your very detailed and knowledgeable posts. Very interesting indeed! You truly are an expert Luftwaffe historian. Now to business... I have an old copy from the german documentary magazine series "Das III Reich" which features on Adolf Hitler from various aspects. One of the articles is about the Fw 200 Condor "Immelmann III" with a cut-through" drawing of the aircraft and a close-up drawing of Hitler's personal seat with the emergency floor hatch and other interesting details. Are you, or anyone else interested in seeing it? In that case I can scan the drawing and post it here.
With best regards,
Krollspell
Let me first thank you for your very detailed and knowledgeable posts. Very interesting indeed! You truly are an expert Luftwaffe historian. Now to business... I have an old copy from the german documentary magazine series "Das III Reich" which features on Adolf Hitler from various aspects. One of the articles is about the Fw 200 Condor "Immelmann III" with a cut-through" drawing of the aircraft and a close-up drawing of Hitler's personal seat with the emergency floor hatch and other interesting details. Are you, or anyone else interested in seeing it? In that case I can scan the drawing and post it here.
With best regards,
Krollspell
"Wie es eigentlich gewesen ist"
Leopold von Ranke (1795-1886)
Leopold von Ranke (1795-1886)
Guten Abend, Herr Doktor!
Thank you for your your complements! As for the photo, why not? There are many aircraft fans and buffs who come here so the photo(s) would be of interest to them. For me personally, one of the sources I cited (C.G. Sweeting) has these photos, too. So, I say go ahead a put them up!
Cheers and kind regards,
--Lorenz
Thank you for your your complements! As for the photo, why not? There are many aircraft fans and buffs who come here so the photo(s) would be of interest to them. For me personally, one of the sources I cited (C.G. Sweeting) has these photos, too. So, I say go ahead a put them up!
Cheers and kind regards,
--Lorenz
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Doktor Krollspell
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Helmut Von Moltke