Alec Salmond please make Scotland independent

[Paddy Keating]

That would be funny were it not so likely to be true, Andy.

PK

[Jock]

Okay....

Troy, Paddy's answer to your question was mostly correct, as was his correction of 'Scotts'. We are indeed Scots.

Although, thanks for the pissing match guys, really enlivened the thread

Regarding the Armed Forces question. Ireland has a full time armed force of around 11,000, and Scotland has 1/5th more population, which gives us a "fair" figure of around 13,500.

Who knows what else a Scottish Defence Force could contain though. I would hope we would maintain at least a few jet interceptors, and it could include such branches as Police/Fire/Ambulance, SaR, Coastguard, even the SFPA.

Most Scots would like to see a strong defence force, to be able to continue our long and proud military heritage, so that we can continue to hold our own on the world stage, and continue to use our position in the world to help and assist those in need.

Cheers,

[Cott Tiger]

Jock, the Scots presence on the world stage, militarily speaking, would evaporate overnight were they to go independent.

Of course whether or not that is a bad thing is an entirely different question, but let’s not kid ourselves that Scottish military tradition and world presence could be maintained without the logistical and financial backing of the British/English.

Regards,

André

[Paddy Keating]

Scotland has quite a proud military tradition and more than enough battle honours to fix to any standard carried by any regiment invested with the honour and battle traditions of earlier times, from Inchtuthill in the early 2nd century through Stirling, York and Bannockburn to the capture of Derby in the 18th century. And then there are battles from colonial wars, world wars and other post-colonial conflicts. You see, Scotland, so we are told, was an equal partner in the Union and that means that she would have the right to lay claim, after independence, to military achievements under the Union Flag.

PK

[Jock]

Double post madness at Feldgrau!

[Jock]

Hi all,

Cott, I, and likely many other Scots, would be more proud to see an independent Scottish battalion in the field for the UN rather the current situation. I would also say that statement stands for all ex-pat Scots, and all people who wish independence for Scotland. An independent unit would do more for Scottish military prestige than the current situation ever could.

Paddy, that's an interesting point. I'm fairly sure there would be no contest concerning the battle honours the present Scots units hold, but are we entitled to battle honours where a significant number of Scots have contributed to the victory?

I'm quite happy with the battle honours we have already. The Scots Guards and Black Watch are (were) two of the best regiments in the Army. I think any sane person would see we have nothing to prove.

Although, Paddy...when the SNP are involved, 'sane' can be a tenacious issue. If you let this idea foster, it will end up in the papers on Thursday that the SNP are trying the claim battle honours for numerous battles, including Stalingrad '43, because St Andrew once traveled near there...



Cheers,

[Cott Tiger]

Nobody is denying Scotland’s proud military history and it’s hard fought and impressive battle honours. We are discussing how this proud history would be continued and upheld were Scotland to become independent and withdraw from the UK.

Were Scotland to go it alone, fielding a battalion in a cosy non-combat UN role might be the limitation of their capabilities. It would certainly be thoroughly incapable of mounting offensive operations abroad such as fighting the Taliban for example. I would suggest that defending Scottish interests abroad militarily would simply be out of the question.

As I said, it’s presence on the world stage (militarily) would be almost non-existent and its military prestige would inevitably suffer. Of course, it’s is your prerogative as to whether you would find that preferable to the situation as it has been under the Union.

Regards,

André

[Jock]

Andre,

I'm going to bed now, I'll get back to this tomorrow.

Pray tell though, how a Scots infantry battalion working with the UN could not take a front line role?

Cheers,

[Cott Tiger]

Jock,

If Scotland went independent it would be incapable of sustaining a prolonged combat operation on foreign soil. Defending Scottish interests by force would cease to be an option.

Many people don't realise that withdrawing from the Union would leave Scotland without a nuclear deterrent and a minute or non-existent air force and navy. In today’s world that might be of some concern to a lot of people.

Anyway, goodnight mate, I need my beauty sleep as well. Speak to you tomorrow.

Kind regards,

André

[Troy Tempest]

Hi Andre, re the nuclear deterrent, I wouldn't sweat it too much. Most countries in the world don't have one, mine included, and I'm glad. I don't think anyone loses sleep here or in any other countries that don't have nukes, so I don't see it would be different for Scotland.

[Paddy Keating]

Given than most of Oz already looks post-apocalyptic, it's a moot point. Who would bother attacking OZ anyway? The problems you face are not from aggressively expansionist nations because Australia really has nothing of much interest to China, Russia or the United States.

The only use they might have for it is as a destination for political prisoners and other undesirables, much as Britain used it in the past. I've often thought that a lot of our social problems could be solved by transporting our undesirables to Australia where they could be formed up into vast columns and marched into the desert wastes, as the Ottoman Turks did with the Armenians. Of course, nowadays, we would have pay you for providing such facilities but I am sure your government would have no moral problems with this.

That aside, your greatest threat comes from immigration and the demographic colonisation of Oz by orientals of various kinds. There again, some of you chaps could do with injections of fresh genes to cure all that FITH Syndrome. But the way Oz appears to be going, you'll all end up looking and behaving like Brazilians, only less adept at dancing and football. Australian girls will still be cute but they'll probably be looking to marry Westerners. Cos you won't be Westerners anymore. And no amount of N-Bombs will save you from that.

PK

[Cott Tiger]

Hi Andre, re the nuclear deterrent, I wouldn't sweat it too much. Most countries in the world don't have one, mine included, and I'm glad. I don't think anyone loses sleep here or in any other countries that don't have nukes, so I don't see it would be different for Scotland.

Hi Troy,

As nuclear weapons proliferate and rogue nations like Iran enter the nuclear fray, perhaps the Scots (if independent) and the Australians will not sleep quite so easily in their beds.

Best regards,

André

[Paddy Keating]

I'd rather see the Iranians with nuclear weapons than the Pakistanis. Iran isn't a rogue nation. It's the only place in the region with a fairly stable government. OK, so they shouldn't be hanging homosexuals, prostitutes, junkies and other marginalised people but there is a strong reform movement working hard to address that problem. The real problem the current US administration has with Iran, as opposed to previous administrations, is that the Neo-Cons who exert such influence are completely freaked by Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's remarks about and proposals for Israel and a solution to the Palestine Question. Israel finds the prospect of a nuclear-equipped Iran intolerable.

PK

[Cott Tiger]

I'd rather see the Iranians with nuclear weapons than the Pakistanis. Iran isn't a rogue nation. It's the only place in the region with a fairly stable government. OK, so they shouldn't be hanging homosexuals, prostitutes, junkies and other marginalised people but there is a strong reform movement working hard to address that problem. The real problem the current US administration has with Iran, as opposed to previous administrations, is that the Neo-Cons who exert such influence are completely freaked by Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's remarks about and proposals for Israel and a solution to the Palestine Question. Israel finds the prospect of a nuclear-equipped Iran intolerable.

PK

Unfortunately, Pakistan already has nuclear weapons. I agree that’s not a desirable situation

As for Iran, are you simply being mischievous when claim it not a rogue state? It’s Islamic fundamentalist, repressive and militarily aggressive. There is indeed a strong reform movement and this should be initially encouraged and favoured above any military action, but I wouldn’t hold your breath over it making any headway.

It’s hardly surprising that Israel finds a nuclear Iran intolerable. The Iranian President has clearly indicated that they wish to acquire such weaponry for the purpose of wiping Israel off the face of the earth. They aren’t too keen on us Western infidels either.

Perhaps Jock and yourself fancy taking the unilateralist approach and living in a world where fundamentalist Islamic states have such weaponry and you don’t. Personally I’d prefer to have it and them not! Obviously in the ideal world nobody would have them, but we don’t live there do we.

Best regards,

Andre

[pzrmeyer2]

OK, so they shouldn't be hanging homosexuals, prostitutes, junkies and other marginalised people

why not?