Good evening to all!
Does anyone know, or know where I can find out, what Kampfgeschwader (Bomber Groups) participated in the
raid on the Allied port of Bari, Italy, evening of December
2nd, 1943?
For such highly successful attack - 17 ships sunk, 65,000 BRT -
I have thusfar found out almost nothing.
I have read the article in World War II Magazine, February 2001.
Article mentions a "Gustav Teuber" Bomber Pilot and Field Marshall
Wofram von Richtofen, little nothing else.
I do know that elements of Kampfgeschwaders 30, 54 and 76
were based in Northern Italy during this time, elements of
LG 1 in Eleusis, near Athens.
Many thanks in advance!
M. Reising
Raid on Port of Bari, Italy, December 2, 1943
-
M. Reising
- New Member
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2003 9:05 pm
-
M. Reising
- New Member
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2003 9:05 pm
Raid on Port of Bari, Italy, December 2, 1943
tjk,
Thanks very much for the information.
I was told earlier that elements of Kampfgeschwaders 30, 54 and 76 participated in the raid. Was unaware that KG's 26, 77 and 100 took
part as well.
In the book, does author mention any particular bomber pilots that
played a leading role?
I have seen the name of a "Gustav Teuber" come up here and there.
Best,
M. Reising
Thanks very much for the information.
I was told earlier that elements of Kampfgeschwaders 30, 54 and 76 participated in the raid. Was unaware that KG's 26, 77 and 100 took
part as well.
In the book, does author mention any particular bomber pilots that
played a leading role?
I have seen the name of a "Gustav Teuber" come up here and there.
Best,
M. Reising
-
sid guttridge
- on "time out"
- Posts: 8055
- Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2002 4:54 am
Hi M. Reising,
I think it was not so much the raid as a whole, as an individual hit on an ammunition ship that made the attack so successful. It was the explosion of this vessel, rather than multiple hits on many vessels, that made the raid a success.
I have even higher figures for the losses: 18 ships totalling 71,566 tons sunk, others damaged and over 1,000 dead and wounded. A spectacular success indeed!
Cheers,
Sid.
I think it was not so much the raid as a whole, as an individual hit on an ammunition ship that made the attack so successful. It was the explosion of this vessel, rather than multiple hits on many vessels, that made the raid a success.
I have even higher figures for the losses: 18 ships totalling 71,566 tons sunk, others damaged and over 1,000 dead and wounded. A spectacular success indeed!
Cheers,
Sid.
-
Ron Klages
- In Memorium †
- Posts: 485
- Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2002 1:39 pm
- Location: Lynnwood, Washington
The Bari Raid
Another source of information on this raid is the excellent magazine AFTER THE BATTLE issue no. 79,
There is an article in this issue by Karel Margry titled Mustard Disaster at Bari.
In the article it notes 19 Allied ships were totally destroyed and 6 others severely damaged. It notes that the greatest tragedy of the raid was the bombing and explosion of the USS John Harvey merchantship which carried in it's holds two thousand 100lb. mustard bombs which we blown apart and spread liquid mustard in the area. The cargo was a secret and had been sent to the area since there had been reports that Hitler, being desperate, had plans of using his own chemical weapons. The Allies widhed to have available to the Allied Air Forces similiar weapons in case Hitler ordered the use of his chemical weapons.
In November, Kesselring had called for a conference to determine the best use of the availble Luftwaffe bombers in the Italy. Attending the conference were FM von Richthofen, CiC of Luftflotte @; GM Dietrich Peltz, CiC of german bomber units in Italy; Captain Werner Baumbach ace bomber grup commander. Each favored a different use of the bombers as follows:
Baumbach-bombing Allied airfields around Foggia
Peltz-mass raids aganist troop concentrations
Richthofen-Allied supply ships and harbors
Richtofen won since for over a week a reconn Me 210 piloted by Oblt. Werner Hahn had been taking pictures of Bari from 23,000 feet and showing the increasing number odf Allied ships in the harbor. The reconn was kept up and it is interesting to note that the Allies had all their fighter aircraft in the area assigned as offensive units supporting Allied bomber operations. None of the Allied fighter units had a role of defense.
On the afternoon of 2 December 1943 there were 30 Allied merchant ships in the harbor waiting to be unloaded. Several thousand Allied troops were in a local stadium to see a baseball game between two American teams from the 5th General Depot. After Hahn returned fromhis afternoon reconn of the harbor he reported the presence of the 30 ships waiting to be unloaded and the order to go was given to the German bombers.
Some 105 Ju 88 bombers from KG26, KG30, KG54, KG76, KG77 and JG100 took off from various airfields in northern Italy. During the flight more bombers joined the flight from airstrips in Yugoslavia. The plan was to attack from the east at low level[45 meters and 200 mph] at dusk [7.35pm]. The attack was not met by Allied fighters and only limited Flak and only 2 Ju 88s were lost.
The following ships were sunk:
USS John Bascomb
USS John L. Motley
USS Joseph Wheeler
USS John Harvey
USS Samuel J. Tilden
British Testbank
British Lars Kruse
British Fort Athabaska
British Devon Coast
Norwegen Lom
Norwegen Bollsta
Norwegen Norlom
Italian Barletta
Italian Frosinone
Italian Cassala
Italian Inaffondabile
Polish Puck
Polish Lwow
Yugoslavia Yug
Seriously damaged:
USS Lymon Abbott
British Crista
British Fort Lajoie
British Brittany Coast
Dutch Odysseus
Norwegen Vest
1000 Allied servicemen had been killed or were missing and in the city of Bari there was heavy damage and many civilian casualities.
After the German bombers had left and the all clear siren sounded the USS John Harvey exploded as a result of the mustard bombs bursting that released the liquid mustard loose in the area. The mustard smoke now spread around the area and the survivors were not aware of the threat being cause bu this situation. The medical personnel did not attempt to clean the mustard and oil misxture that covered the skin of many of the casualities and as a result the survivors now began having severe burns and blisters of the skin that were not a result of fire but the mustard. In a short time the medical personnel realized that these injuries were not being caused by the explosions and fire of the attack but now they bean to suspect a chemical substance. It was even being talked that the Germans had dropped chemical bombs by some while others wondered if the cargo on some of the ships was the cause.
The fighting casualities coming in from the active front to the west soon forced the medical personnel to divert their attention to these cases and they label the survivors of the bombing with the skin burns and blisters as NYD-Not Yet Diagnosed. In a few days these patients began to die from the burns annd blisters and skin lesions. The medical personnel performed autopsies on these dead and it was determined that mustard was the cause. Of course this only added to the rumor that the Germans had dropped chemical bombs. However the American investigators were soon able to analyze the explosion remnants and it was determined that the mustard had been contained in an americam bomb.
It appears that 84 people died from the effects of the mustard although the number is believed to have been grated since many of the casualities had been transferred out of the area prior to the determination od mustard as the cause of the skin lesions. It is also estimated that 1000 civilians died from the effects of the mustard since they did not have access to the treatments available to the servicemen.
While it was determined by command that the USS John Harvey carried the mustard bombs the story was kept secret until 1971 when the historian Glenn Infield released a book Diaster at Bari.
Sorry for the length of the post but it is a summarization of the article in After the Battle. The article is 14 pages in length and contains 35 photos and 4 drawings. The magazine is still available in the US from RZM Imports. It can be ordered from their website.
best regards,
Ron Klages
There is an article in this issue by Karel Margry titled Mustard Disaster at Bari.
In the article it notes 19 Allied ships were totally destroyed and 6 others severely damaged. It notes that the greatest tragedy of the raid was the bombing and explosion of the USS John Harvey merchantship which carried in it's holds two thousand 100lb. mustard bombs which we blown apart and spread liquid mustard in the area. The cargo was a secret and had been sent to the area since there had been reports that Hitler, being desperate, had plans of using his own chemical weapons. The Allies widhed to have available to the Allied Air Forces similiar weapons in case Hitler ordered the use of his chemical weapons.
In November, Kesselring had called for a conference to determine the best use of the availble Luftwaffe bombers in the Italy. Attending the conference were FM von Richthofen, CiC of Luftflotte @; GM Dietrich Peltz, CiC of german bomber units in Italy; Captain Werner Baumbach ace bomber grup commander. Each favored a different use of the bombers as follows:
Baumbach-bombing Allied airfields around Foggia
Peltz-mass raids aganist troop concentrations
Richthofen-Allied supply ships and harbors
Richtofen won since for over a week a reconn Me 210 piloted by Oblt. Werner Hahn had been taking pictures of Bari from 23,000 feet and showing the increasing number odf Allied ships in the harbor. The reconn was kept up and it is interesting to note that the Allies had all their fighter aircraft in the area assigned as offensive units supporting Allied bomber operations. None of the Allied fighter units had a role of defense.
On the afternoon of 2 December 1943 there were 30 Allied merchant ships in the harbor waiting to be unloaded. Several thousand Allied troops were in a local stadium to see a baseball game between two American teams from the 5th General Depot. After Hahn returned fromhis afternoon reconn of the harbor he reported the presence of the 30 ships waiting to be unloaded and the order to go was given to the German bombers.
Some 105 Ju 88 bombers from KG26, KG30, KG54, KG76, KG77 and JG100 took off from various airfields in northern Italy. During the flight more bombers joined the flight from airstrips in Yugoslavia. The plan was to attack from the east at low level[45 meters and 200 mph] at dusk [7.35pm]. The attack was not met by Allied fighters and only limited Flak and only 2 Ju 88s were lost.
The following ships were sunk:
USS John Bascomb
USS John L. Motley
USS Joseph Wheeler
USS John Harvey
USS Samuel J. Tilden
British Testbank
British Lars Kruse
British Fort Athabaska
British Devon Coast
Norwegen Lom
Norwegen Bollsta
Norwegen Norlom
Italian Barletta
Italian Frosinone
Italian Cassala
Italian Inaffondabile
Polish Puck
Polish Lwow
Yugoslavia Yug
Seriously damaged:
USS Lymon Abbott
British Crista
British Fort Lajoie
British Brittany Coast
Dutch Odysseus
Norwegen Vest
1000 Allied servicemen had been killed or were missing and in the city of Bari there was heavy damage and many civilian casualities.
After the German bombers had left and the all clear siren sounded the USS John Harvey exploded as a result of the mustard bombs bursting that released the liquid mustard loose in the area. The mustard smoke now spread around the area and the survivors were not aware of the threat being cause bu this situation. The medical personnel did not attempt to clean the mustard and oil misxture that covered the skin of many of the casualities and as a result the survivors now began having severe burns and blisters of the skin that were not a result of fire but the mustard. In a short time the medical personnel realized that these injuries were not being caused by the explosions and fire of the attack but now they bean to suspect a chemical substance. It was even being talked that the Germans had dropped chemical bombs by some while others wondered if the cargo on some of the ships was the cause.
The fighting casualities coming in from the active front to the west soon forced the medical personnel to divert their attention to these cases and they label the survivors of the bombing with the skin burns and blisters as NYD-Not Yet Diagnosed. In a few days these patients began to die from the burns annd blisters and skin lesions. The medical personnel performed autopsies on these dead and it was determined that mustard was the cause. Of course this only added to the rumor that the Germans had dropped chemical bombs. However the American investigators were soon able to analyze the explosion remnants and it was determined that the mustard had been contained in an americam bomb.
It appears that 84 people died from the effects of the mustard although the number is believed to have been grated since many of the casualities had been transferred out of the area prior to the determination od mustard as the cause of the skin lesions. It is also estimated that 1000 civilians died from the effects of the mustard since they did not have access to the treatments available to the servicemen.
While it was determined by command that the USS John Harvey carried the mustard bombs the story was kept secret until 1971 when the historian Glenn Infield released a book Diaster at Bari.
Sorry for the length of the post but it is a summarization of the article in After the Battle. The article is 14 pages in length and contains 35 photos and 4 drawings. The magazine is still available in the US from RZM Imports. It can be ordered from their website.
best regards,
Ron Klages
Ron Klages
Lynnwood, Washington USA
Lynnwood, Washington USA
-
M. Reising
- New Member
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2003 9:05 pm
Radi on Bari, December 1943
Ron,
Thank you for the information, and for recommending that article!
This is the most that I have found out thusfar regarding the raid.
Best,
M. Reising
Thank you for the information, and for recommending that article!
This is the most that I have found out thusfar regarding the raid.
Best,
M. Reising
-
101stDoc
- Associate
- Posts: 742
- Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2003 7:55 pm
- Location: Midwest, United States of America
Re: The Bari Raid
Hi Ron.Ron Klages wrote:
It is also estimated that 1000 civilians died from the effects of the mustard since they did not have access to the treatments available to the servicemen.
While it was determined by command that the USS John Harvey carried the mustard bombs the story was kept secret until 1971 when the historian Glenn Infield released a book Diaster at Bari.
Couple points...
The roughly 1,000 civilian casualties often quoted INCLUDES the dead from the bombing itself, which hit portions of the city prior to hitting the harbor area. It is unknown how many were killed by the gas, but it likely most of the fatalities were from the bombing.
As far as Infield goes, his book is OK in some areas and outright BS in others. Some of his claims, such as the British harbor staff knowing about the mustard gas prior to the raid is pure bull. There's a mountain of evidence that contradicts this, amongst other issues.
For those who would like a more updated (and more accurate) account of the raid, albeit quite a bit lighter than Infield on the German side, read the section of the book "Liberty" by Peter Elphick, published by Naval Institute Press.
Doc