USAAF B 17 and B 24 losses in the Med. 1943

The Allies 1939-1945, and those fighting against Germany.

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Enrico Cernuschi
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USAAF B 17 and B 24 losses in the Med. 1943

Post by Enrico Cernuschi » Sun Jun 17, 2007 3:18 am

Hello Gentlemen,

are the aircratf Allied losses in the Med. since January until Sept. 1943 available?

I'm pariculaury interested about the USAAF B-17 and B-24 losses. The famous Ploesti raid in Aug. 1943 numbers are well known, but ther's almost nothing regarding the heavy bombers losses during their offensive against Italy since April until August 1943.

Many thanks

EC
Ciàpla adasi, stà léger.

Carl Schwamberger
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Post by Carl Schwamberger » Sun Jun 17, 2007 6:49 pm

This site may have a link to what you are looking for. I'll check my shelves here for anything.

http://www.armyairforces.com/

What is the purpose of your inquiry?

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Enrico Cernuschi
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Post by Enrico Cernuschi » Mon Jun 18, 2007 9:26 am

Hello Carl,

thank you for the suggestion; anything you could find on the shelf would be, anyway, welcome.

Until early April 1943 the USAAF four engined bomber offensive against Italy was a small one, then it increased dramatically until Aug. 1943 when the losses over Ploesti and the call in Britain of an important part of the American bomber force to face the German bitter defence of the Reich reduced the weight of the USAAF raids again, even if they remained quite serious until the 8 Sept. 1943 armistice and later.
I'm trying to appreciate how much the numerical mass of the American bombers helped them to reduce or contain their losses in front of a German and Italian fighter force and ack ack organization whose strenght and tactics did not developped very much during Spring and Summer 1943.

Greetings

EC
Ciàpla adasi, stà léger.

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Re: USAAF B 17 and B 24 losses in the Med. 1943

Post by milbay » Mon Jun 18, 2007 7:37 pm

Enrico Cernuschi wrote:Hello Gentlemen,

are the aircratf Allied losses in the Med. since January until Sept. 1943 available?

I'm pariculaury interested about the USAAF B-17 and B-24 losses. The famous Ploesti raid in Aug. 1943 numbers are well known, but ther's almost nothing regarding the heavy bombers losses during their offensive against Italy since April until August 1943.

Many thanks

EC
Yes the FULL listing with Airplanes Number / Pilot's name date etc etc etc is available online but SORRY I don't remember where. I have downloaded it a year ago and I don't even know myself where I put these files.
do a reasearch on USAAF Casualties.
Gunter

Carl Schwamberger
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Post by Carl Schwamberger » Wed Jun 20, 2007 4:16 pm

Enrico Cernuschi wrote:
I'm trying to appreciate how much the numerical mass of the American bombers helped them to reduce or contain their losses in front of a German and Italian fighter force and ack ack organization whose strenght and tactics did not developped very much during Spring and Summer 1943.
From memory, the tight or dense formations used for the raids worked, but not nearly as well as the USAF leaders expected. That if the raids had been flown in many dispersed formations the losses would have far worse. As it was the losses caused the idea of the unescourted bomber to be reconsidered.

My books just have general comments, but I have a couple more to check.

ciao

Carl Schwamberger
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Post by Carl Schwamberger » Fri Jun 22, 2007 9:36 am

The remaining items I looked at dont add any hard numbers to this. It is clear that when faced with a solid fighter defense the US bombers suffered badly, even when en mass & in a dense formation. The few examples I have of small groups suggests the losses were no better or even worse when there was a similar level of defense. ie: 11 lost of 11 bombers on the infamous second Imejin Holland raid in 1943.

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