Hello!
I have inconsistencies in my sources regarding the HE Rounds for the 17 pounder on the Sherman Firefly. Some sources say that it did not have an HE round but only AP Rounds, while other sources say that it did, in fact, have an HE round but that it was rather ineffective, much like the HE round for the 76mm Sherman when compared to the HE round for the 75mm. Anyone know the truth regarding this? Thanks in advance!
Cheers,
Wolfkin
Sherman Firefly 17 Pounder HE Rounds
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Sherman Firefly 17 Pounder HE Rounds
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John Kilmartin
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Hi Wolfkin,
Look on the first page of Was the tiger really king? in the weapons and equipment section. There is a reference to a set of tables in the fourth or fifth message on the first page. That should help you out. I seem to recall there being APDS rounds along with AP but your best bet is the table refered to.
John K
Look on the first page of Was the tiger really king? in the weapons and equipment section. There is a reference to a set of tables in the fourth or fifth message on the first page. That should help you out. I seem to recall there being APDS rounds along with AP but your best bet is the table refered to.
John K
' Strip war of the mantle of its glories and excitement, and it will disclose a gibbering ghost of pain , grief, dissappointment and despair'
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phylo_roadking
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HE (High Explosive) rounds first came in service with the 17 pdr from late September 1944.
APDS (Amour Piercing Discarding Sabot) rounds also became available at around the same time.
ps, APDS for the 6 pdr was issued in small quantities from May 1944
The HE round for the 17 pdr was indeed not quite as good as the US 75mm round, but having said that, it should be pointed out that the US 75 mm HE round was one of the best of its type.
APDS (Amour Piercing Discarding Sabot) rounds also became available at around the same time.
ps, APDS for the 6 pdr was issued in small quantities from May 1944
The HE round for the 17 pdr was indeed not quite as good as the US 75mm round, but having said that, it should be pointed out that the US 75 mm HE round was one of the best of its type.
if in doubt, PANIC !!!!
I've read that the APDS had some issues early on but by the end of the Normandy fighting it was working.
US troops from 26th Inf Regt used the 6 pdr version of APDS at Butgenbach in the Ardennes and got very impressive results against 12 SS which had a mixture of hard to knock out panzers.
Nobody has ever made it clear how they happened to have obtained that ammo.
Wikopedia has another view of the APDS specific to the 17 pdr and addresses your question about HE:
"The disadvantages of APDS as compared with the 17-pdr's regular APCBC ammunition was that it was much less accurate and did not do nearly as much damage to an enemy tank if it did penetrate. APDS shot remained rare accounting for only about 6% of the average loadout of a 17-pdr equipped British tank.
Initially the HE shell that was developed for the 17 pdr lacked power. This was due to the high powered cartridge - the shell walls had to be thicker to stand the stresses of firing leaving less room for explosive. Reducing the size of the propelling charge for the HE shell allowed the use of a thinner walled and more explosive shell."
cheers
Reb
US troops from 26th Inf Regt used the 6 pdr version of APDS at Butgenbach in the Ardennes and got very impressive results against 12 SS which had a mixture of hard to knock out panzers.
Nobody has ever made it clear how they happened to have obtained that ammo.
Wikopedia has another view of the APDS specific to the 17 pdr and addresses your question about HE:
"The disadvantages of APDS as compared with the 17-pdr's regular APCBC ammunition was that it was much less accurate and did not do nearly as much damage to an enemy tank if it did penetrate. APDS shot remained rare accounting for only about 6% of the average loadout of a 17-pdr equipped British tank.
Initially the HE shell that was developed for the 17 pdr lacked power. This was due to the high powered cartridge - the shell walls had to be thicker to stand the stresses of firing leaving less room for explosive. Reducing the size of the propelling charge for the HE shell allowed the use of a thinner walled and more explosive shell."
cheers
Reb