Hi there,
Just finished reading Robert Harris' "Fatherland" for the third time.. (Excellent book I might add).
Now, I was wondering if anyone could Can recommend other "what if" novels in the mold of the one by Harris? (Nazi Germany winning the war etc.)
Best "what if" novels?
Moderator: Commissar D, the Evil
Thumbs up:
I recently read "1945" and I was surprised.
It got some horrendous reviews (mainly because one of the authors was once a speaker of the US congress I think). But then others bemoaned most that there wasn't a second part since the story's ending seems to demand that.....
I found it well written, fast paced, with interesting places and characters, an easy read with an fascinating plot (and everything with Skorzeny innit can't be bad)
http://www.amazon.com/1945-Newt-Gingric ... 059&sr=8-2
Thumbs down:
The "Fox on the Rhine" and "Fox on the Front" series about Rommel surrendering to the western allies and turning around against the Nazis.
The whole thing was so full of stereotypes and a crude plot I was continously angered during reading...only the character of Peiper (of course here the worst villain) kept me reading.
But I didn't do it a second time...
http://www.amazon.com/Fox-at-Front-Rhin ... 357&sr=1-4
PS: I just lOVE "What if" novels!
(If they give Germany a chance that is...)
I recently read "1945" and I was surprised.
It got some horrendous reviews (mainly because one of the authors was once a speaker of the US congress I think). But then others bemoaned most that there wasn't a second part since the story's ending seems to demand that.....
I found it well written, fast paced, with interesting places and characters, an easy read with an fascinating plot (and everything with Skorzeny innit can't be bad)
http://www.amazon.com/1945-Newt-Gingric ... 059&sr=8-2
Thumbs down:
The "Fox on the Rhine" and "Fox on the Front" series about Rommel surrendering to the western allies and turning around against the Nazis.
The whole thing was so full of stereotypes and a crude plot I was continously angered during reading...only the character of Peiper (of course here the worst villain) kept me reading.
But I didn't do it a second time...
http://www.amazon.com/Fox-at-Front-Rhin ... 357&sr=1-4
PS: I just lOVE "What if" novels!
(If they give Germany a chance that is...)
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Tom Houlihan
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phylo_roadking
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There is a whole raft of these, some are good, some are dross. I'm not at my own house this week so I can't read off my shelves, but when I can I'll list what I have.
I agree - 1945 is pretty good, better than you'd think from its very contrived first half...but the final half is excellent and I LOVE the Alvin York episode! THAT is a flash of inspiration LMAO I think there were actually due to be two other parts - obviously 1946 and 1947 LOL The original got published at the hieght of newt's involvement in party politics, hence the bad reviews I think too, and also his MAIN interest is the American Civil War, and his writing on that took and remained in precedence.
A personal favourite is "All the King's men" at least with a happier ending than SS-GB, although there are a LOT of histroical and military errors in it. But once you read past them its a good yearn.
SS-GB is likewise good - but sadly you just KNOW what the end is going to be!
Let's see - other WWII alternative histories - well, theres "The Man In The High Tower" by Philip K. Dick, as in "Bladerunner" - more pure sci-fi, ita about a conquered USA, where the protagonists learn of an "alternative" timeline where the US won WWII by way of interpretations of the Tao and I Ching!!!
I'll provide a list of others next week.
Are you only interested in WWII alternative histories??? 'Cos you'rer missing SO many other classics along the way, especially the whole plethora of Cold War alternative histories....let alone the retrospective "historical" ones.
I agree - 1945 is pretty good, better than you'd think from its very contrived first half...but the final half is excellent and I LOVE the Alvin York episode! THAT is a flash of inspiration LMAO I think there were actually due to be two other parts - obviously 1946 and 1947 LOL The original got published at the hieght of newt's involvement in party politics, hence the bad reviews I think too, and also his MAIN interest is the American Civil War, and his writing on that took and remained in precedence.
A personal favourite is "All the King's men" at least with a happier ending than SS-GB, although there are a LOT of histroical and military errors in it. But once you read past them its a good yearn.
SS-GB is likewise good - but sadly you just KNOW what the end is going to be!
Let's see - other WWII alternative histories - well, theres "The Man In The High Tower" by Philip K. Dick, as in "Bladerunner" - more pure sci-fi, ita about a conquered USA, where the protagonists learn of an "alternative" timeline where the US won WWII by way of interpretations of the Tao and I Ching!!!
I'll provide a list of others next week.
Are you only interested in WWII alternative histories??? 'Cos you'rer missing SO many other classics along the way, especially the whole plethora of Cold War alternative histories....let alone the retrospective "historical" ones.
"Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." - Malcolm Reynolds
Not to forget Harry Turtledove!
But I'm not sure about my judgement about him:
His "World War" series is must even if I lost interest later on as he really made Germany pay
But otherwise I was highly disappointed at his "In the presence of mine Enemies" about a jewish family in hiding in a Berlin after the Nazis won the war.
I was seldom this dissappointed!
Such a great, interesting plot and such a horrible, boring, predictable, badly written story!!!
That was a book where I thought I won't never read anything by Turteldove again.
But I'm not sure about my judgement about him:
His "World War" series is must even if I lost interest later on as he really made Germany pay
But otherwise I was highly disappointed at his "In the presence of mine Enemies" about a jewish family in hiding in a Berlin after the Nazis won the war.
I was seldom this dissappointed!
Such a great, interesting plot and such a horrible, boring, predictable, badly written story!!!
That was a book where I thought I won't never read anything by Turteldove again.
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Rolf Steiner
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If you like Turtledove check out "Final Impact" by John Birminham.
Both sides get some weapons from the future. Sea Lion fails and the final battles between the Reich and the allies are very well done and catastropic for all concerned..
Hint - picture Stalin and Hitler with a few nukes - trying to figure out what to hit.
And Patton giving his famous speech to the black tank battalion - only in this they are using much better tanks than the Shermans they actually had.
cheers
Reb
Both sides get some weapons from the future. Sea Lion fails and the final battles between the Reich and the allies are very well done and catastropic for all concerned..
Hint - picture Stalin and Hitler with a few nukes - trying to figure out what to hit.
And Patton giving his famous speech to the black tank battalion - only in this they are using much better tanks than the Shermans they actually had.
cheers
Reb
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phylo_roadking
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Reb is that the sequel to the one about the 21st century US fleet popping out beside Midway???? I didn't know it was out yet, the UK market is usually 6months behind the US.
If you want a GOOD one-hit Turtledove romp - "Ruled Britannia"!
If you want a GOOD one-hit Turtledove romp - "Ruled Britannia"!
"Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." - Malcolm Reynolds
MH
everybody paid in that one!
Naturally, the Poles got slammed...
I'm trying now to remember the title of one I read recently - where it turned out that the Brits had infiltrated a double of Hitler which explained why he made such dumb moves like invading Russia!
the guy ended up awash in guilt since he was unable to stop so many horrors.
My problem is that with none history books I read 'em and then immediately mail 'em to my brother. With my memory, the titles go out with the post!
cheers
Reb
everybody paid in that one!
Naturally, the Poles got slammed...I'm trying now to remember the title of one I read recently - where it turned out that the Brits had infiltrated a double of Hitler which explained why he made such dumb moves like invading Russia!
the guy ended up awash in guilt since he was unable to stop so many horrors.
My problem is that with none history books I read 'em and then immediately mail 'em to my brother. With my memory, the titles go out with the post!
cheers
Reb
Howdy all, back from the dead as it were.
M.H. I ain't gonna lie, in the 60s the Reich gets POUNDED. That's the bad news. The good news is it kills off all the Nazis! Non-nazi Third Reich Whoo who! Well I like it anyway, and anyway, those damn Kraut bastards don't quit; they rebuild Europe and put more men into space and are right behind the Americans in FTL travel IIRC as of the end of Homeward bound.
M.H. I ain't gonna lie, in the 60s the Reich gets POUNDED. That's the bad news. The good news is it kills off all the Nazis! Non-nazi Third Reich Whoo who! Well I like it anyway, and anyway, those damn Kraut bastards don't quit; they rebuild Europe and put more men into space and are right behind the Americans in FTL travel IIRC as of the end of Homeward bound.
MH
It got quite wierd when Skorzeny and a Jewish Resistance guy teamed up to blow up a 'snake' base.
Turtledove never addresses the question of why the Deutch are the most aggressive fighters his space travelers encounter. I confess his Molotov is probabably the scariest character in the book(s).
See John Ringo's Posleen War for a spinoff that includes resurrection of the Waffen SS to fight against hungry space invaders. Muhlenkamp is givin command of a new SS Pz Korps with supertanks (Tiger III) to fight the Posleen. (aging vets are rejeuvenated using alien tech). There are a few minor errors but all in all this wasn't bad.
cheers
Reb
It got quite wierd when Skorzeny and a Jewish Resistance guy teamed up to blow up a 'snake' base.
Turtledove never addresses the question of why the Deutch are the most aggressive fighters his space travelers encounter. I confess his Molotov is probabably the scariest character in the book(s).
See John Ringo's Posleen War for a spinoff that includes resurrection of the Waffen SS to fight against hungry space invaders. Muhlenkamp is givin command of a new SS Pz Korps with supertanks (Tiger III) to fight the Posleen. (aging vets are rejeuvenated using alien tech). There are a few minor errors but all in all this wasn't bad.
cheers
Reb
Turtledove is jewish and I think that his books are heavily influenced by that. I don't want to say biased but he tries to show with his figures somehow desperate that not ALL were bad and even salvageable but else he relishes to make Germans somehow inhumanly skilled and devilish...Reb wrote: Turtledove never addresses the question of why the Deutch are the most aggressive fighters his space travelers encounter. I confess his Molotov is probabably the scariest character in the book(s).
![:[]](./images/smilies/icon_study.gif "Study"){kind=icon}
(But I was quite disappointed as he finished Skorzeny off...he was one of the best characters I thought...so much fun!
)I know...wasn't this plot highly interesting and enjoyable???Reb wrote: See John Ringo's Posleen War for a spinoff that includes resurrection of the Waffen SS to fight against hungry space invaders....
I liked it very much!