KO'd tanks used as strong points

German weapons, vehicles and equipment 1919-1945.

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Einsamer_Wolf
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KO'd tanks used as strong points

Post by Einsamer_Wolf » Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:08 pm

I was wondering if anyone had any photos or other references evidencing the used of destroyed tanks as strongpoints. My understanding is that both sides on the Ostfront would incorporate destroyed tank hulls as strong points. With a trench dug out from under the hull, only a direct hit from artillery could knock out the machine gun nest. An example of such a stronghold is the subject of one of Shep Paine's diorams, photos of which I have attached.

EW
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Post by Doktor Krollspell » Tue Dec 11, 2007 12:02 pm

Hello EW!

I don't know if you also are looking for tank turrets used as street level stationary Pak guns but here's one from Berlin during the fighting in 1945. Unfortunately I don't remember where I found the photograph... :?


Pantherstellung
Image


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Post by Einsamer_Wolf » Wed Dec 12, 2007 5:32 pm

I am aware the germans used tank turrets in the final days. THose photos are easy to come by. What I am reffering to is in the field, in which infantry would entrench themselves around a destroyed tank hull. Shepard Paine did a diorama caled hornet's nest, which featured a machine team under the hull of a destroyed 34, with an entrenchment ditch dug under the hull of a tank. Only a direct hit by heavy artillery would destroy such a strongpoint.

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Post by phylo_roadking » Wed Dec 12, 2007 5:36 pm

E-W....am tempted to say it's NOT subject matter that anyone would have had much leisure to photograph!
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Post by Paulus II » Sun Dec 23, 2007 1:40 am

On this site:
http://www.peter-engelhardt.com/foto-wolchow-2.htm# provided by Annelie in the photosection there is one photo of a KV-1 used as strongpoint or 'Gefechtsstand'.
Picture number 26.

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Post by Reb » Sun Dec 23, 2007 7:57 am

In Herbert Meyer's history of the 12 ss he quotes a young tank officer as being sent with some men to re-occupy some knocked out tanks in front of Krinkelt / Rochrath by Jurgensen.

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Post by Doktor Krollspell » Sat Feb 09, 2008 5:32 am

Hello again E.W. et al!

Here's a text about the HQ of the Aufklärungs-Abt. of the 12. SS-Pz.Div. "Hitlerjugend" during the battle for Normandy. They are using a Sherman as protection/cover. The photograph is copyrighted by the website so just follow the source link and judge for yourself if it's the front of a Sherman that you can see...
The Division's Aufklärungsabteilung, under the command of SS-Sturmbannführer and Ritterkreuzträger Gerd Bremer, were among the first Divisional elements to reach the front on 7. June. Upon arrival they traveled through 8 miles of no mans land to the Division's far left flank and there established a security line. The Abteilung repulsed numerous heavy attacks from 7-11. June, during which Bremer's command vehicle was knocked out and then the next day he was wounded by shrapnel. Twice wounded he nevertheless remained with his Abteilung until the situation was secure. The Allies penultimate attack came on 11. June, when the English 50th Infantry Division attacked the Abteilung sector in the strength of one Infantry battalion and 84 tanks. The attack was violently repulsed and the positions were held, 7 tanks were knocked out and the English suffered over 250 casualties. The above photo was taken between 12-15. June at the Abteilung command post in Cristot, where one of the 7 knocked out Shermans was salvaged by Hstuf. von Reitzenstein (Chef 5./A.A. 12) and Ustuf. Wieneke and placed over the command post bunker as protection against shrapnel. Here Bremer sits with his adjutant, SS-Obersturmführer Kurt Buchheim. Among other actions, but primarily for this four day defensive struggle, Bremer was decorated with the German Cross in Gold on 30. August. Photo courtsey Roger Bender - Blood and Honor.
http://home.att.net/~SSPzHJ/Photos.html


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Re: KO'd tanks used as strong points

Post by Paulus II » Tue Dec 23, 2008 12:28 pm

Just came across the picture below and remembered this thread. Not sure if the Pz VI in question is 'KO'd' but there is a trench under it though it may be it is just dug under a parked vehicle to provide some shelter for the crew and others in case of shelling.
Anyway.......

Image

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Re: KO'd tanks used as strong points

Post by Jan-Hendrik » Thu Dec 25, 2008 11:01 am

The Tiger men I spoke called that the "Heldenkeller", not unsual in Normandy 1944 :wink:

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Re: KO'd tanks used as strong points

Post by TJK06 » Wed May 20, 2009 11:41 am

Related to this topic, I am aware of WWII German tanks used as strong points in Syrian bunkers on the Golan Heights captured by Israel during the Six Day War in 1967. When I saw them, I knew they weren't Russian or American, so I thought they were maybe French. A few years later, I saw a picture in a book and recognized that they were German. It is my understanding that they were captured by Russia and given to Syria in the 50's or 60's. I don't know it they are still there. If anyone is interested, I can locate and post the photo.

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Re: KO'd tanks used as strong points

Post by Paulus II » Wed May 20, 2009 2:34 pm

Hi TJK06 and welcometo the forum!

The story of the German tanks that served in Syria (well....part of it anyway) can be found in this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=44&t=21251&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=syrian

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Re: KO'd tanks used as strong points

Post by TJK06 » Wed May 20, 2009 3:17 pm

Thanks for the information. I'm new to the site and have a lot to learn.

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Re: KO'd tanks used as strong points

Post by bf109 emil » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:02 pm

TJK06 wrote:Related to this topic, I am aware of WWII German tanks used as strong points in Syrian bunkers on the Golan Heights captured by Israel during the Six Day War in 1967. When I saw them, I knew they weren't Russian or American, so I thought they were maybe French. A few years later, I saw a picture in a book and recognized that they were German. It is my understanding that they were captured by Russia and given to Syria in the 50's or 60's. I don't know it they are still there. If anyone is interested, I can locate and post the photo.
from wikipedia they where supplied by the french and spain not russia
In the 1960s Syria received a number of Panzer IVs from the French, replacing the turret's machine gun with a Soviet-made 12.7-millimetre (0.50 in) machine gun. These were used to shell Israeli settlements below the Golan Heights, and were fired upon during the 1965 "Water War" by Israeli Centurion tanks.[95] Syria received 17 more Panzer IVs from Spain, which saw combat during the Six-Day War in 1967.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzer_IV
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Re: KO'd tanks used as strong points

Post by TJK06 » Thu Jun 11, 2009 12:04 am

This sounds like the tanks I saw.

Thanks.

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