Denazification of Waffen-SS-soldiers

Brian67 · Post by **Brian67** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 1:38 pm

Who knows how the denazification of former Waffen-SS-men was made?
Exists an archiv, where you can take a look in the decissions, the Allies did?

sid guttridge · Post by **sid guttridge** » Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:09 am

Hi Brian,

I have seen a multi-volume series of official publications on German POWs in British hands.

If you look up the British Library Catalogue on the net and put in the key words relating to POWs in English in the title search you should come up with a title.

Cheers,

Sid.

Craig Soward · Post by **Craig Soward** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 2:48 pm

I have always been fascinated by the term "Denazification"; I wonder how it would have been possible to change people's ideals & beliefs, especially the younger Germans who'd had the Nazi ideology drummed into them, from such an early age.
I would imagine that this would have been especially difficult in the Nazi elite SS & WAFFEN SS units; the Nazi ideology was the core part of their existence, as a political army for the reich.
I wonder what many SS Veterans attitudes are today, to things such as their former leaders, their former "cause" & the Jews?

Tom Houlihan · Post by **Tom Houlihan** » Tue Jul 13, 2004 3:50 pm

Craig, the couple that I've talked to have come to realize that the 'cause' they were fighting for was wrong. While there are still a few unrepentant Nazis around, most regret it.

sid guttridge · Post by **sid guttridge** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 3:03 am

Hi Craig,

Most German POWs in British hands persisted in their confidence in Nazism until the hundreds of thousands of prisoners taken in Normandy began to come in in late 1944. From that point on they had overwhelming evidence that reality differed from the "final victory" the Nazis hierarchy in and out of the camps would have them believe in and most began to make pragmatic adjustments in their attitudes. Only a small minority of ideologues failed to make this adjustment by 1948, when the last German POWs in the West were released. The die-hards were then sent home as a small and discredited minority with little continuing influence. And so it proved.

Cheers,

Sid.

Craig Soward · Post by **Craig Soward** » Wed Jul 14, 2004 6:03 am

Cheers Tom & Sid for your insights, much appreciated

I guess it would have been easier for the rankin file Heer soldier to readjust to civilian life after the war, compared to SS men, who had been indoctrinated with the Nazi ideology, more so than their Heer counterparts.

The notion of "re-education" just fascinates me, brings images of the communist re-education camps & what took place in Vietnam, many years later; just find it hard to believe that someone's beliefs could be changed like that. Maybe I am a bit naive but I just find it hard to imagine & comprehend, that's all.

sid guttridge · Post by **sid guttridge** » Thu Jul 15, 2004 4:39 am

Hi Craig,

I think that pragmatism and exposure to reality in 1944-45 meant that Western Allied re-education programmes were pushing at an open door as far as the overwhelming majority of rational German POWs were concerned.

Cheers,

Sid

Craig Soward · Post by **Craig Soward** » Sat Jul 17, 2004 6:32 pm

Yes Sid, I guess you are right; by this stage of the war, all but the most dedicated Nazi's knew the war was lost. I guess the attitudes to the former Nazi regime in 2004 Germany is a reflection of the effectiveness of this de-nazification & re-education.

Cheers,

Craig.

sid guttridge · Post by **sid guttridge** » Mon Jul 19, 2004 3:06 am

Hi Craig,

I would rather think that it was down to a rational and extended appraisal of the evidence and the facts.

De-nazification and re-education only worked in the long term because the evidence and the facts were largely with them, not against them, and because Germans have generally been morally courageous in facing the horrible reality of the Nazi period. Germans today are probably the best adjusted of all the former Axis peoples as a result.

Cheers,

Sid

Craig Soward · Post by **Craig Soward** » Mon Jul 19, 2004 5:39 am

I would be interested Sid to see what history (in regards to Germany's role in WW2) is taught in German schools today. From what I have read, there are very tight restrictions on things such as making a Nazi salute (which I read somewhere is now a jailable offence, could be wrong???), which I think is taking things a little too far.
I guess old wounds maybe never heal over, even with the passing of nearly 60 years....

sid guttridge · Post by **sid guttridge** » Tue Jul 20, 2004 4:26 am

Hi Craig,

There may well be some over reaction, but rather that than complacency. For example, the UK and now France will hold referenda on the proposed European Constitution. However, because Hitler repeatedly abused referenda in the 1930s they are not allowed under the post-war German constitution. So, ironically, as a result of an effort to prevent a repeat of such abuse, Germans today will have less direct democratic input into the EU Constitution than the Brits or French.

Cheers,

Sid.

Craig Soward · Post by **Craig Soward** » Sun Dec 05, 2004 4:36 am

Sid, I dont think that is being complacent, just over the top. Looks like the Germans are still suffering from being defeated in 1945, nearly 60 years later.

sid guttridge · Post by **sid guttridge** » Sun Dec 05, 2004 7:09 am

Hi Craig,

I don't think restrictions on the use of Nazi salutes in schools in Germany represents any real suffering. I agree that it is a bit excessive by UK standards, but we have gone through a different historical process.

The same might be said of the recent banning of the the wearing of headscarves in French schools, or the display of religious symbols in US schools. All are insignificant in their own right but have strong symbolic value. All are symbolic of Western democracies being dedicated to secular, apolitical school systems.

Indeed, if I had my way, the state in the UK wouldn't be subsidising Church of England, Catholic, Jewish or Muslim schools either.

Cheers,

Sid.

WT · Post by WT » Sun Dec 05, 2004 3:11 pm

A late business acquaintance of mine was a German paratrooper and I had no doubt that he was a hard core Nazi ...... even 30 years after the war. He told me a story.

He was captured at Brest, France and was sent to a POW camp in Mississippi. This camp held paratroopers and SS men. After the war, the POW's went thru a 'de-Nazification' process. He was then sent to Britain, held as a POW until 1948 and finally returned home to Hamburg in the British Sector.

First thing, because of the Berlin Blockade, all former German soldiers were inducted into a 'National Guard' or 'Territorial Army' battalion. They were expected to hold off a Soviet attack on West Germany.

After some training they were lined up for review by their British Army commanders. On marching in front of the reviewing stand, the German soldiers broke into the 'goosestep' as they had learned in the past. The British reviewing officers were somewhat upset by this.

Craig Soward · Post by **Craig Soward** » Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:55 pm

Hi, an interesting insight into Denazification.

I always find it interesting how the Allies who had fought for the duration of the war, to destroy Nazi Germany, then spent the next 50 years fighting the "Cold War" against each other.

As you say here, these former German soldiers were expected to hold off a potential attack, by the Russians, against West Germany, which I find facinating!

Obviously, many of these former soldiers remained Nazi's for many years to come (some may still be), so obviously this "Denazification" process wasnt all that successful was it?

Cheers,

Craig.

Feldgrau.net

Denazification of Waffen-SS-soldiers

Denazification of Waffen-SS-soldiers

Denazification

Interesting.