Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

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haen2
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by haen2 » Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:33 pm

Hello Sebastiaan,
I did indeed think about translating it in Dutch, but for now I want to see if it flies by itself :D
The "book"is a halfbreed novel and historical biography; it is not intended to be a kriegstagesbuch, nor does it only cover the Waffen SS time.
There is a whole (long) section beforehand, describing how a young man, gets to the point of enlisting in the W.SS.
Some factors include a jewish grandmother on one side and a flag waving nazi german one on the other side.
As ANY healthy boy of 16, Hans (the subject) falls in love a few times, and it is included as well.
Tom Houlihan has helped me cut it down to a reasonable size. John Moore also has read it and put on CD a copy of it, perhaps either one of them could tell in a nutshell what it is all about, so people can make up their mind if they really want it or not.
There are some factors that are fairly unbelievable, and the reader has to take my word for their authenticity.
If it flies, I certainly will think about a Dutch version.
HN
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by Tom Houlihan » Sat Oct 17, 2009 2:25 pm

It's a helluva read, there's no doubt about that. There was only one part that seemed a little fantastic to me, and there was one area where HaEn's memory didn't seem to coincide with historical information. I attributed that to a slightly clouded memory after 60+ years!

I was able to look up a good bit of the information provided, and it fit. He's either telling his story as best he remembers, or he's a great liar. I've talked to him many times. He doesn't lie well. :wink:
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sebastian
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by sebastian » Sun Oct 18, 2009 1:26 am

Im hoping on a dutch translation one day,but could read it in english ofcourse,its just easier reading in the language you use everyday!

Haen,
I have read Mussertman aan het Oostfront from Paul Metz,i dont know if you know this man or this book,im guessing your book will be something like that,just that it has a different end,because P.Metz never came back home.A fine story from a frontline soldier,an easy read too.But again thats a book that will never see any translation probably so there are loads of great storys an info that goes"lost in translation" and i hope i can read all about Hans in dutch one day,or in english

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Sebastian
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by John P. Moore » Sun Oct 18, 2009 8:07 am

I enjoyed reading the manuscript and am in agreement with Tom's comments. However, as I have explained to Haen, I do not agree with his approach of mixing fact and fiction. The reader should not be placed in the position of having to guess whether these tales are fact or fiction. My advice to him was to get rid of the fiction and stick to the facts which should still make the book a very good read.

John

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haen2
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by haen2 » Sun Oct 18, 2009 2:30 pm

)
John P. Moore wrote:I enjoyed reading the manuscript and am in agreement with Tom's comments. However, as I have explained to Haen, I do not agree with his approach of mixing fact and fiction. The reader should not be placed in the position of having to guess whether these tales are fact or fiction. My advice to him was to get rid of the fiction and stick to the facts which should still make the book a very good read.
John
Thanks John,
I think ( first time for everything :D ) that I used the wrong wording, as you pointed out in the p.m.
I''ll try to set this straight:
The story is about a series of events, and experiences. However after so many years it is logical that I do not remember the verbatim conversations or sequences that took place. Just the total picture of the "gestalt". THAT's where the word "novel" slipped in, for lack of a better one.
THUS conversations and situations were recreated to best best of recollection.
For example: " I arrived, talked, convinced and left", would not make much of a picture in the reader's mind; they may just be curious about WHAT was said and done; the latter becomes than a matter of fecollection and reconstruction.
IF it would be more acceptable for most readers, I will be most happy to call the whole writing a novel, leaving it up to the reader to decide how much and/or what they want to see as reality. It than becomes a good story with no pretense attached.
In the latter case, i might just go back to the "fly on the wall" approach. as I originally penned it down in the third person, i.e. "he did" "he saw" rather than the first person approach that Aberjona wanted.
Notice how I m getting more and more confused :( :oops:
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by Alex Dekker » Sun Oct 18, 2009 11:51 pm

HaEn, my advice is the following: write it in the way it feels good for yourself. After all, in the end it's your story. And since you're the publisher, you can do anything you want.
Always in need for info about: Dutchmen in the NSKK, HJ and TeNo.

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haen2
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by haen2 » Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:47 am

Again. thanks for all the input, people ( posts / e-mails / p.m.'s)
Interesting point: Last nigth I woke up in a near panic. I suddenly had "remembered" a scene, where some comrades and I went across a small river (tributary of the Rhine ?). during the night, to take out an allied M.G.nest. The "memory" was there in living color, complete with sounds, talks, faces , etc. The PROBLEM is that I never went in a boat across the water, to take out an M.G.nest. And when I got to my study, and "cooled down" I realized that I just had "re-lived" a scene I had READ about in either a book (probably "Nederlanders in Europeesche krijgsdienst"), or an article about it.
I sat there, sorting my thoughts, thinking: How many of the experiences and memories of old people like me, come from the same basket ????
How many people have "recognised" campguards from pictures, who subsequently were found guilty of someting ? How many "war-memories" are 100% real ?

The good news is that I have strived very hard to reconcile memories with published or otherwise proven situations.
But . . . .will others see it that way too ? There are several parallells that can be applied to similar situations, and may look as if they were "me - too" items.

Other scenes could be seen as "possible and probable" but may seem far fetched. For example, a Gestapo officer, who gets on the scene, tries to move from one very old fashioned train compartment (only an outside running board, (no passageway inside) to another, for which he has to swing between doors, outside, stepping on the running board and holding on to a handrail; he slips, falls, rolls with the speed of the train, smacks into a telegraph pole, and is 'kaput"; this was pointed out to me by mt friend Tom H.

The last thing I want to be is to be seen as some old crackpot, just telling stories. I was actually not 'writing a "book", to begin with; just penning down some memories, mine and other's for my kids and grandkids, if they ever would be interested in them.
It was one of my granddaughters who convinced me to "glue them all together and make it into a book.

Just thought to get this off my soul; and now back to work to finish the darn thing.

HN
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haen2
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by haen2 » Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:51 am

p.s. O.M.G. I HATE getting old :( :x
On the other hand, if you don't want to be old, you got to hang yourself, while you are young.
What achoice :shock: :oops:
Oh well. HN
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by chambers » Mon Oct 19, 2009 7:21 pm

I've seen that old age is no place for sissies.

And if that guy really did slip and fall off the train then so be it. Most accidents hapen when someone does omething they shouldn't. My friends husband was cutting wood w/a circular saw barefoot this summer, yep he almost lost his big toe.
"If you didn't see it with your eyes, don't create it with your mouth."

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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by Alex Dekker » Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:39 am

I almost got my foot crushed and hurt my leg badly (a wound of 25 cm long, 3 cm width, did see the bone), because I was setting a stone on it's place at a graveyard... Yep it hurt badly, no I didn't cry and kept on going @{ .
Always in need for info about: Dutchmen in the NSKK, HJ and TeNo.

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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by Kritonner » Thu Oct 22, 2009 4:36 am

Well, Haen, if you like I will ask my publisher if he is interested in publishing your book in Dutch. He can help with your memory too. Mostly it has nothing to do with age but with the way everybodies memory works. We've seen it in the interviews of the prisoners at Camp Amersfoort (recorded in the early 60's) and the paratroopers in the Market-Garden operation too. Their stories are partly based on the book "A bridge too far" and even more on the film.
The question wheter it should be on paper or on cd, I would say both. Most important, as far as I'm concerned, is a rapid release. It would help making the Ginkel-film seen through the eyes of the WB 3. I've started this production recently but information is hard to get. The story is mainly based on your information in this forum but that's a thin line as far as historians are concerned.
By the way, next Sunday a new series on WW2 in Holland starts on Dutch TV. It shows that history is hot and furthermore that the German side of the events is becoming a more normal part of the story.
So the market is good, time to publish !
Herman

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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by Kritonner » Thu May 27, 2010 4:57 am

Recently we started the preparations for the sequal of Market-Garden documentation. The idea is to tell the same story but now from the Dutch SS point of view. I took the liberty to use the information of Haen2 on this forum to create a storyline. Many thanks for that !
I'm still looking for former Dutch SS members to give some background to the story. It's hard to find reliable sources but we keep on trying. Some Dutch museums are helping me out and the Dutch NIOD institute is cooperating too. Furthermore the son of Sepp Dietrich is one of people who are filling the story with details about the ideas of the SS. His own life is a remarkable story too.
The film is sceduled for September 17th 2010, show at the battlefield location: Ginkel Heath near Ede and Arnhem.
I'll keep you posted.

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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by Tom Houlihan » Thu May 27, 2010 7:40 am

Reading what Sepp's son remembers from the war would be quite interesting! Sepp as a Dad is probably a lot different from Sepp as a combat commander!!
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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by Kritonner » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:14 pm

Some good news and some bad news. Starting with the bad, Sepp junior has declined his cooperation. He's afraid that talking on camera will hurt his business in the Netherlands. Freedom of speach comes at a price. The good news is that the documentary covers more than just the WB at Amersfoort and will focus on the history of the Dutch SS in combat. I will trie to answer the "why-question". Why did people join the Waffen SS and why did they fight to the end and even after the so called VE-day.
just returned form a trip to Bastogne and it looks like Russia in the winter. Lots of reenactors there and we were able to shoot some fine pictures in snow and ice.
I'm still looking for some good inside stories and more footage. The project is called The forgotten Batallion. it refers ofcourse to the Wachbattalion 3 and their part in the Market-Garden operation and the results will be a 60 minute film and a book.
I wonder if I can use the real name of Haen2 ?

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Re: Veterans SS Nordwest who served in Holland

Post by Kritonner » Sat Aug 20, 2011 2:21 am

Dear all,
The remake of the documentary in English, is scheduled for september 14 in the local cinema. The dvd is for sale from that moment on. I used some real footage of the Wachtbataljon from Amersfoort and one of the former members is telling part of the story. Furthermore I used the story of Haen2 as a guideline. I used my own voice to talk the viewers through. The study however is not finished yet but there was no time left to go to Koblenz and Berlin. That will be the next move in the story.
Thank you all for helping me this far.
Regards,
Herman

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