SS Hauptsturmfuhrer Norbert Scharf no. 2473

Martin H · Post by **Martin H** » Wed Oct 09, 2002 7:07 am

Norbert Scharf was my great Uncle and a career soldier with a NSDAP no. 67694. The 300 page microfilm from the USA military archives is extensive but does not give any information about his death.

My research through this forum suggest that he may have been part of Kampfgruppe "Binz" in Italy at the end of WWII.

The officers listed include a Franz Scharf as an SS Ostuf to Franz Binz.
Is this a typo?

The officer above Norbert was SS - Oberfuhrer Jungkunz, commander of the 29 WGDdSS Italy no.1. in the summer of 1944.

The demise of battle group Binz came about by their surrender to USA troops from 1st armoured division near Gorgonzola just east of Milan and the rest of the battle group including Binz surrendered to 34th US Infantry division near Lake Kerrer in South Tyrol according to Siegrunnen no.64

Any comments or suggestions on where to find more information is appreciated.

J. Buck · Post by **J. Buck** » Thu Oct 10, 2002 6:45 am

From German War graves site, I was able to acquire following info:
Otto Jungkunz, Oberscharfuhrer, born July 23, 1892, in Wurzburg, KIA on June 9, 1945 but not known where. On a Norbert Scharf, there are 2 listed: 1 from Breslau, MIA on Jan 23, 1945. Another a Feldwebel, born Oct 31, 1917, KIA in Italy Oct 12, 1943 at Cassino. Hope this helps.

Martin H · Post by **Martin H** » Sun Oct 13, 2002 7:48 pm

The one I am looking to find is Norbert Scharf from Breslau, MIA on Jan 23, 1945. Do you have any more details as to where he was MIA?

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Mon Oct 14, 2002 2:38 am

Volksbund does not show MIA as it is the wargraves site it only lists those who were KIA and they`re burial place is known, you need to write to the Red Cross, my Uncle did this when searching for my Great Grandfather who was MIA in Poland, they have good records of people who are missing presumed dead and should give you the best information, the only other possiblity is to contact a Veterans association for his Unit(if one exists) and contact the secretary with your questions which he will ask members and if anyone remembers anything they will inform you hopefully.
Hope this helps
Brian.

J. Buck · Post by **J. Buck** » Mon Oct 14, 2002 7:26 am

Brian, What you say about the German war graves commision is not accurate. Yes they do list known graves, absolutely, but they also list some killed, without knowing where there graves are. An example of this is my great uncle Dietrich Schloen, listed as KIA on July 28, 1944, but his body was never found to this day. They do state however if they do find his body he will be buried in the Central German War cemetary in Poland. Another example is my other great uncle Friedrich Feldmann listed as dying in a Russian POW hospital, but no known grave. Sometimes they list a name with even less information on where they died, etc.. JB

J. Buck · Post by **J. Buck** » Mon Oct 14, 2002 7:32 am

Martin, Only info on Norbert Scharf is that he was "Vermisst" MIA on that date. Good Luck and write to Deutsche Dienstelle and red Cross. JB

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Mon Oct 14, 2002 11:11 am

John, i didn`t realise that they listed MIA`s, sorry for the Inaccuracy, coincidentally my GGrandfather Gerhard Scholze went missing in the Lublin Chelm area of Poland between the 20th and 28th of July 44, no doubt your great Uncle was a similiar victim of Bagration, where did he go missing?

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Mon Oct 14, 2002 11:13 am

He was not declared KIA until June 1945.

J. Buck · Post by **J. Buck** » Mon Oct 14, 2002 11:54 am

Hey Brian, I do not know where Lublin is in Poland, But I do know where my Great uncle went missing, maybe you will know if it is close by. He was KIA on July 28th, 1944 about 12 kilometers West of Brest-Litovsk (Border of Poland and Byelorussia). His unit (The decimated 459th I.R. and the rest of KorpAbteilung "E") were told to stand fast at "Festung" Brest-Litovsk" against the fast moving Russian Juggernaut, whick quickly surrounded them and continued moving West. Finally on July 26th Hitler relented and gave permission for a breakout of the surrounded units to the front lines in the West, My uncle was killed on July 28th in the middle of the atempted breakout, near the little town of Berezowka. He was killed from a head wound and due to the circumstances of his retreat was left where he fell. Like you said another victim of Operation Bagration. Best Regards, JB

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Fri Nov 01, 2002 2:23 am

Yes that is a sad example of the desperation of the last ragged attempts to hold the front, My GGrandfather was a Gefreiter with Betr.St.Verw.Kp.572 which i have been told was a unit that was normally well behind lines and carried out such duties as fuel distribution, he was 43 years old and had 5 young children in Berlin without a mother who had died during the war, apparently Lublin was on an important road junction and was defended by elements of the SS and security forces, i have found out that they abandoned their heavy weapons when the partisans made their initial attack and turned the city centre into a fortress of sorts, there was much house to house fighting and all were killed except a very small group of SS who escaped somehow, no one reported seeing my GGrandfather after the siege began so he must have been killed during the retreat to the city.
Best Regards
Brian.

martin4179 · Post by **martin4179** » Sat Aug 19, 2023 2:22 pm

In my great uncles case, it was established that his widow had actually gone to the red cross and registered Norbert as missing. That may explain some of the process that was in place at the time. No actual war grave, simply information that was provided by a concerned relative.

J. Buck wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 14, 2002 7:32 am
Martin, Only info on Norbert Scharf is that he was "Vermisst" MIA on that date. Good Luck and write to Deutsche Dienstelle and red Cross. JB

martin4179 · Post by **martin4179** » Sat Aug 19, 2023 2:29 pm

The question about involvement with Kampfgruppe Binz has been fully explored. Whilst there are similarities with surnames and areas of operations etc, there is no direct link to Norbert Scharf who was found to be in Tolmezzo. Italy working with the Cossack's at this time. The Scharf that appears on the list as adjutant for Binz may have been a relative as he was also from Silesia nearby where Norbert grew up and served in Breslau (now Poland). Possibly a cousin or something of that nature.

Martin H wrote: ↑
Wed Oct 09, 2002 7:07 am
Norbert Scharf was my great Uncle and a career soldier with a NSDAP no. 67694. The 300 page microfilm from the USA military archives is extensive but does not give any information about his death.

My research through this forum suggest that he may have been part of Kampfgruppe "Binz" in Italy at the end of WWII.

The officers listed include a Franz Scharf as an SS Ostuf to Franz Binz.
Is this a typo?

The officer above Norbert was SS - Oberfuhrer Jungkunz, commander of the 29 WGDdSS Italy no.1. in the summer of 1944.

The demise of battle group Binz came about by their surrender to USA troops from 1st armoured division near Gorgonzola just east of Milan and the rest of the battle group including Binz surrendered to 34th US Infantry division near Lake Kerrer in South Tyrol according to Siegrunnen no.64

Any comments or suggestions on where to find more information is appreciated.

Feldgrau.net

SS Hauptsturmfuhrer Norbert Scharf no. 2473

SS Hauptsturmfuhrer Norbert Scharf no. 2473

KIA

War Graves Commision has MIA too!

Ok

PS

Sad

Re: War Graves Commision has MIA too!

Re: SS Hauptsturmfuhrer Norbert Scharf no. 2473