Panzer Division "Hermann Göring", July 1943

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Loic
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Panzer Division "Hermann Göring", July 1943

Post by Loic » Tue Jun 17, 2003 9:08 am

Hello all !

I posted this question a couple of weeks ago, but nobody answered me. I hope I'll have more success this time ;-)

I have some figures for this unit on the eve of operation "Husky". Just before the landing of 7th US Army and 8th UK Army in Sicily, Panzer Division "HG" had :
- 43 PzKpfW III lang
- 3 PzKpfW III Ausf. N
- 32 PzKpfW IV lang
- 7 PzBefW
- 20 StuG III
- 9 StuH 42

Total : 114 tanks of assault guns.

We must add the 17 "Tiger" of the 2./schw. Pz. Abt. 504.

Are these figures correct ?

I need also the manpower and artillery strenghts of the division on July 10th 1943 (or early July, at least). Does anyone could provide me these figures ?

Extra-question (simple curiosity :-)) : what were the "HG" units which were destroyed in Tunisia on May 1943 ? I thought there was not the entire division in Africa, but it seems I'm wrong...

Thank you very much by advance !

Loic

Ron Klages
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Questions Regarding HG

Post by Ron Klages » Wed Jun 18, 2003 4:30 pm

First some information regarding HG in Tunisia.

The units sent to North Africa came from Division General Göring which had been established in November 1942 from Brigade General Göring. The division was formed with the following elements:
• Grenadier Regiment 1 Hermann Göring [formed from Schützen-Rgt. HG]
• Grenadier Regiment 2 Hermann Göring
• Jäger Regiment Hermann Göring [formed from 5. Fsch.Jg, Rgt.]
• Artillerie-Regiment Hermann Göring [formed from the 11th thru 13th batteries of the HG Flak Rgt.]
• Panzer-Regiment Hermann Göring [formed from 13. company of HG Schützen Rgt.]
•Panzer-Aufklärungs-Abteilung Hermann Göring [formed from 10. company of HG Schützen Rgt.] [reconn. unit]
• Panzer-Pioneer-Battalione Hermann Göring [formed from 11. company of HG Schützen Rgt.] [engineer unit]
• Flak-Regiment HG
• Panzer-Nachrichten-Abteilung HG [signals unit]
• Versorgungstruppen HG [support units]


The first element of the division to go to Tunisia was:
• 1. and 3. /Jäger Regiment Hermann Göring in early November 1942
In early 1943 the following units were sent:
• 1.,2.,3./Grenadier Regiment 1 Hermann Göring
• 1. and 2./Flak-Regiment HG
• 3./Panzer-Regiment Hermann Göring with 2 Pz.III(lang) and 8 Pz. IV (lang)
• Panzer-Aufklärungs-Abteilung Hermann Göring
• Panzer-Pioneer-Battalione Hermann Göring
• Panzer-Nachrichten-Abteilung Hermann Göring
• Medical Battalione Hermann Göring
• Administrative Unit Hermann Göring

Regarding the question of the armor at the start of Operation Husky on Sicily I have the following quantities of armor for HG.

20 StuG IIIs
9 StuH 42s
43 Pz. III (lang)
3 Pz. III (7.5)
32 Pz. IV (lang)
7 BefsPz. (Pz III befehls)

attached was 2./sPzAbt. 504 with 17 Tiger Is.

Therefore my data is in agreement with your data.


While fighting in Sicily HG lost:
28 Pz. IIIs
21 Pz. IVs
4 BefsPz.
4 StuG IIIs
3 StuH 42s

From another set of records that I have I find that on 31 August 1943 from the daily panzer reports HG had the following situation:

StuG IIIs 3 in short term repair and 13 operational for a total of 16
StuG Hs 1 in short term repair and 5 operational for a total of 6
Pz. III (lang) 13 in short term repair and 13 operational for a total of 26
Pz.III (75) 3 in short term repair and 0 operational for a total of 3
Pz.IV (lang) 29 in short term repair and 13 operational for a total of 42
BefsPz. no report available
From these numbers it would indicate that HG in Italy had received the following replacements by 31 August 1943 for the losses in Sivcily:

StuG IIIs none
StuH 42s none
Pz. IIIs both types 14
Pz. IV (lang) 31
BefsPz. not known

This latter data is a bit more info than requested.

Regarding the manpower and artillery strength questions I am not able to help there.

Hope this data helps.

Best regards,

Ron Klages
Ron Klages
Lynnwood, Washington USA

Hans Weber
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Post by Hans Weber » Thu Jun 19, 2003 12:48 pm

Hello Loic,

I think this could interest you: One of your fellow countryman just published a fine title: Alain Verwicht's Hors Serie No 3 of Panzer Voran! exclusivly deals with HG. It contains a commented Gliederung dated 16. April 43 and a nice series of photos. The pics taken in Sicily eg show a Grille with the clock like tactical symbol, a nice 250 ammo carrier with StuG III, some more StuG III and good studies of the Grenadiers. In Panzer Voran! No 12 the Gliederung dated 1.9.43 can be found. Not exactly what you are looking for regarding the date, but maybe helpfull anyway.
Cheers
Hans

AtheistDane
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Re: Panzer Division "Hermann Göring", July 1943

Post by AtheistDane » Wed May 03, 2017 7:03 pm

I hope it is okay to resurrect this 14-year-old thread.

Does anyone know what level of training/experience the Herman Goering Panzer Division had in July 1943?

The reason I'm asking is that I'm making a mission for a game (Combat Mission: Fortress Italy) and I have to set their experience and motivation. Experience is supposed to reflect training level and combat experience, with the following options: Conscript, Green, Regular, Veteran, Crack and Elite.
Motivation is supposed to reflect morale, with the following options: Poor, Low, Normal, High, Extreme and Fanatic.

By default HG units are set to "Green" experience and high/normal motivation.

Your help and knowledge will be greatly appreciated. :D

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John W. Howard
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Re: Panzer Division "Hermann Göring", July 1943

Post by John W. Howard » Fri May 12, 2017 11:59 pm

Hello: The commander of the division in Sicily, Paul Conrath, was incensed to learn that some of his troops ran rather than fight!! The unit was poorly trained and made up of various Luftwaffe personnel; it had no combat experience, so I would say "Green" would be about right. Morale would be normal, I would say. Best wishes.
John W. Howard

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