dear srs,
Has anybody tracked the DAK kampstafel movements and actions during the Gazala battles.
I've found no information about them.
Many thanks
Eduard
DAK kampfstaffel movements during gazala battle
Moderator: Tom Houlihan
-
- New Member
- Posts: 15
- Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:00 pm
Re: DAK kampfstaffel movements during gazala battle
First, it appears from some differents sources and documents that there is on fact two Kampfstaffeln :
- Armeekampfstaffel (named also Kampfgruppe Khiel) ;
- Korpskampsftaffel.
Before the end of last El Alamein's (or perhaps before) these two "kasta" were merged in one unit, sacrified during the latest fights of the 3-4 of november.
These two small and mobile units were reinforced with Flak and some others detachments, and had a really complexe role during the Gazala's battle.
So it is posible to point sometimes one or other unit in a specifical action, but very hard to rebuilt all their movements and actions. It is also difficult to fill the blank.
If you are Ok, I can try to find what exactly I have on it...
But as I merged this old thread, not sure that anybody else will be interested on such researches...
Sorry for the delay of this answer, as I only register a few days ago...
CM
- Armeekampfstaffel (named also Kampfgruppe Khiel) ;
- Korpskampsftaffel.
Before the end of last El Alamein's (or perhaps before) these two "kasta" were merged in one unit, sacrified during the latest fights of the 3-4 of november.
These two small and mobile units were reinforced with Flak and some others detachments, and had a really complexe role during the Gazala's battle.
So it is posible to point sometimes one or other unit in a specifical action, but very hard to rebuilt all their movements and actions. It is also difficult to fill the blank.
If you are Ok, I can try to find what exactly I have on it...
But as I merged this old thread, not sure that anybody else will be interested on such researches...
Sorry for the delay of this answer, as I only register a few days ago...
CM
Re: DAK kampfstaffel movements during gazala battle
Cedric
It would be very nice of you to help in this area
Thanks
Eduard
It would be very nice of you to help in this area
Thanks
Eduard
-
- New Member
- Posts: 15
- Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:00 pm
Re: DAK kampfstaffel movements during gazala battle
Eduard,
I will try to do my best !
Please wait till this week-end,
I will then check my documents.
CM
I will try to do my best !
Please wait till this week-end,
I will then check my documents.
CM
-
- Supporter
- Posts: 95
- Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2002 7:53 am
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Re: DAK kampfstaffel movements during gazala battle
After several years of looking, I finally found a ToE for Kampfgruppe "Kiehl."
--Kampfgruppe "Kiehl" - Panzerarmee "Afrika" Kampfstaffel – Kiehl – HQ – 5 x Pz II
----2./606. Heer Fla Abteilung (sfl.) – (from 90. leichte Afrika Division) - 8 x SdKfz 10/4, 2 x SdKfz 7/1
----1 Zug/39. Panzerjager Abteilung (mot.) – (from 21. Panzer Division) - 3 x 50mm Pak
----1 Zug/33. Pionier Bataillon (mot.) – (from 15. Panzer Division)
----1 PzSpah Zug/3. Panzeraufklarungs Abteilung – (from 21. Panzer Division) – 4 x SdKfz 222
----beute Panzer Kp. – 12 x M3 Stuart
As for movements, good luck. Maybe you'll be able to glean some info from situational maps.
--Kampfgruppe "Kiehl" - Panzerarmee "Afrika" Kampfstaffel – Kiehl – HQ – 5 x Pz II
----2./606. Heer Fla Abteilung (sfl.) – (from 90. leichte Afrika Division) - 8 x SdKfz 10/4, 2 x SdKfz 7/1
----1 Zug/39. Panzerjager Abteilung (mot.) – (from 21. Panzer Division) - 3 x 50mm Pak
----1 Zug/33. Pionier Bataillon (mot.) – (from 15. Panzer Division)
----1 PzSpah Zug/3. Panzeraufklarungs Abteilung – (from 21. Panzer Division) – 4 x SdKfz 222
----beute Panzer Kp. – 12 x M3 Stuart
As for movements, good luck. Maybe you'll be able to glean some info from situational maps.
Re: DAK kampfstaffel movements during gazala battle
Are you sure?2 x SdKfz 7/1
This would be the first time I have ever seen this combination mentioned in the North African context. Very exciting!
Thanks. Dave.
-
- New Member
- Posts: 15
- Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:00 pm
Re: DAK kampfstaffel movements during gazala battle
I have the 24th of may a preliminary note from Flak-regiment 135 which detailed the followings informations :
Regimentstab and 1./ Flak-regt 43 zur Korpskampfstaffel (the DAK Kasta) ;
3./ Flak-regt 43 zur Kampfstaffel Rommel (named after this ArmeeKampstaffel)
...
At the beginning of the battle, the KG Khiel was constituted from various division, as it is shown above (I have different figures, all with teh same main components with a lot of variation in details and numbers of tanks, Ac or vehicles).
It first known action was a strong and fast intervention to save the Panzerarmee Afrika Stab, threaten by an attack of 10th Hussars (28th of may at 18h30). This action was supported by italian tanks from Ariete and situation was rapidly restored.
Thsi unit spent most part of 29th and 30th of may in support of the strong arty line built by italians (V/1° artiglieria celere with germans 88 and a gruppo of 90/53) and germans (8,8cm), against all british's tanks attacks (2nd and 22nd armoured brigades) from the East, near Bir el-Aslagh.
No others informations after...
The 7th of june in the evening, Rommel called his own ArmeeKampfstaffel to strenghten the attacks against Bir Hacheim with some reinforcements sent by 15. Panzer-division. After the fall of the free french strongpoint, the 11th of june, Rommel let there a detachment from Pavia reinforced by Armee-kampfstaffel and Aufklarungs-kompanie 580 to patrol in the area.
Hope this will help, I will try to find others informations later...
Regards,
CM
Regimentstab and 1./ Flak-regt 43 zur Korpskampfstaffel (the DAK Kasta) ;
3./ Flak-regt 43 zur Kampfstaffel Rommel (named after this ArmeeKampstaffel)
...
At the beginning of the battle, the KG Khiel was constituted from various division, as it is shown above (I have different figures, all with teh same main components with a lot of variation in details and numbers of tanks, Ac or vehicles).
It first known action was a strong and fast intervention to save the Panzerarmee Afrika Stab, threaten by an attack of 10th Hussars (28th of may at 18h30). This action was supported by italian tanks from Ariete and situation was rapidly restored.
Thsi unit spent most part of 29th and 30th of may in support of the strong arty line built by italians (V/1° artiglieria celere with germans 88 and a gruppo of 90/53) and germans (8,8cm), against all british's tanks attacks (2nd and 22nd armoured brigades) from the East, near Bir el-Aslagh.
No others informations after...
The 7th of june in the evening, Rommel called his own ArmeeKampfstaffel to strenghten the attacks against Bir Hacheim with some reinforcements sent by 15. Panzer-division. After the fall of the free french strongpoint, the 11th of june, Rommel let there a detachment from Pavia reinforced by Armee-kampfstaffel and Aufklarungs-kompanie 580 to patrol in the area.
Hope this will help, I will try to find others informations later...
Regards,
CM