Machinengewehr-Battalion 8

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Kommandeur

Machinengewehr-Battalion 8

Post by Kommandeur » Sat Nov 05, 2005 10:55 am

Hi All

I read the thread "Machinegewehr-Battaillon (mot) 4, 13 & 14. April 1940." with interest since I am interested in Maschinengewehr-Battalion 8.

I believe this unit became the third battalion of 21st Panzer's Panzergrenadier Regiment 104 (I think it was designated as such) around the time of the beginning of the campaign in Tunisia.

Does anyone know the theoretical/actual organisation and composition of this unit, and if this changed when it became part of the 104th?

Thanks in advance.

DK
Last edited by Kommandeur on Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:32 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Richard Schoutissen
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Re: Maschinengewehr-Battalion 8

Post by Richard Schoutissen » Sat Nov 05, 2005 11:55 am

Some info I found regarding the Maschinengewehr-Bataillon 8.

15 Oct 35 raised in Züllichau, WK III
1 Sep 39 III Corps, 4th Army, Army Group North
5 Feb 1940 reinforced by addition of a motorized pionier and a Pak company. The latter two from Grenzwacht-Rgt. 66 and 76
10 May 40 XV Corps, 4th Army, Army Group A
3 Jun 40 attached to 4th Panzer Division, XIV Corps (mot.), 6th Army, Army Group B
23 Jan 41 assigned to 5th Leichte Division and later sent to Libya
FtF: Sep I 39, 4th Army, Army Group North, 1x 1-10 mot MG II 8
FoF: 1x 1-8 mot MG II 8

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Kampfgruppe Kautenfeld

Raised 30.April 1941 for the intended attack at Tobruk.
arrangement:
- Panzer-Regiment 5
- Panzerjäger-Einheit
- Maschinengewehr-Bataillon 2
- Maschinengewehr-Bataillon 8
- Artillerie-Einheit
- Flak-Einheit
- 2 Pionier-Kompanien
Commander:
Generalmajor Heinrich Kirchheim
Combat/Campains:
Combat at Tobruk, May 1941

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Gruppe Schuette/Kampfgruppe Schuette

Gruppe Schuette raised 3. September 1941 for the "Sommernachtstraum" (Summernightdream) campaign. It operated together with Kampfgruppe "Stephan". On 14.Febr.1943, during the fights over Sidi bou Zid, the combat team Schuette was again set up.
Arrangement:
Gruppe Schuette:
- Panzerjäger-Abteilung 605 (fewer than a company)
- Maschinengewehr-Bataillon 8
- Flak-Abteilung 606 (fewer than a company)
- One Kompanie/Pionier-Bataillon 200
- Some vehicles for insure some captured material
Kampfgruppe Schuette:
- One Abteilung/Panzer-Regiment 5
- Stab/Panzer-Grenadier-Regiment 104
- Panzerjäger-Abteilung 39/609
- I./Artillerie-Regiment 155 (1. and 3. Batterie)
- Flakkampftruppe (88 mm)
Commander:
Major Schuette
Battle/Campaign:
Campaign "Sommernachtstraum" (Summernightdream) (Libya, September 1941); Battle at Sidi bou Zid (Tunis, 14.-15. Febr.1943)

Richard

David W
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Post by David W » Sat Nov 05, 2005 1:57 pm

8th M/G Batt: April 1941.

StaB Ko: 1 x Pio zug. 10 x SdKfz 251/1. 11 x le/mg.

3x Ko: 15 x S/mg 3 x le/Gr.

PzJag Ko: 9 x 37mm PaK. 3 x le/mg.

Schwere Ko: 6 x 37mm PaK. 2 x le/mg. 6 x S/GrW.

Krad Ko: 18 x le/mg 8 x S/mg. 3x le/Gr.

Pio Ko: 9 x le/mg. (used in Aug '41 to form part of 200th Pz Pio Batt).
Thanks. Dave.

Kommandeur

Post by Kommandeur » Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:16 am

Hi bladerunner
Hi David W

Thanks for the information. I've been doing a little homework too ...

I have managed to sit down with my German girlfriend and decipher some references to MG 8 in Heinz-Dietrich Aberger's "Die 5.(lei.)/21. Panzer-Division in Nordafrika 1941-1943", as follows:

p187 "Das OKH hatte angeordnet, daß die bisher selbständigen Heerstruppen, die Maschinengewhr- und Krad-Shützenbataillone in die Schützenregimenter einzugliedern sind. ... das MG.Btl.8 als erstes Bataillon in das Schtz.Rgt.104 eingegliedert, dessen I.Bataillon im Halfayapaß in Gefangenschaft geraten war. Das bisher zur 15.Pz.Div. gehörende Krad.Schtz.Btl.15 wurde III/Schtz.Rgt.104."

The gist of which is that after an OKH order (sometime around March/April 1942) MG bn 8 became the first btn of the 104th, and 15th Panzer's 15th m/c bn became the third battalion. (1bn 104th had been taken prisioner I think).

Aberger goes on to list the 104th as follows:
"I. Btl. Major Schütte
II. Btl. Oberstlt. Frhr. v.Eckhardstein
III. Btl. Major d.R Ehle"

This is the 'transitional' period I'm interested in. Any pointers regarding composition of the old MG 8/new 1 bn at this time?

Cheers

DK

David W
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Post by David W » Sun Nov 06, 2005 10:18 am

(sometime around March/April 1942)
10th March is the date that I have.
Thanks. Dave.

Kommandeur

Post by Kommandeur » Sat Nov 12, 2005 5:06 am

Hi David W

Is it possible that these units were re-equipped when joining the 104th or did their equipment and organisation remain the same?

Any clues?

Thanks in advance

DK

David W
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Post by David W » Sat Nov 12, 2005 1:23 pm

Hi.

As far as I can tell, the following addittions were made to the T.o&E I posted above.

28/08/41: 1 x Pio Zug arrives to fill void left by departing Pio Ko.

10/03/42: PzJag Ko & Schwere Ko reinforcements = 6 x S/Gr.W
12 x 28mm PaK. 12 x 50mm PaK.

More info than that, I do not have. Sorry.
Thanks. Dave.

Kommandeur

Post by Kommandeur » Sun Nov 13, 2005 5:39 am

Hi David W

That's very helpful, thank you.

I'll keep chipping away at this one ... maybe the thread will be 'bumped' in the near future!

DK

jungerpreusse
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Re: Machinengewehr-Battalion 8

Post by jungerpreusse » Wed May 09, 2018 12:22 am

Hi,

my grandfather served in the MG-Bataillon 8. Did you read the "nur ein Bataillon..."?
There is much information about all your questions. I´ve got a lot of pictures as well...

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