"Let me entertain you....."

[Paddy Keating]

Oh my sainted aunt...

PK

[phylo_roadking]

I hope you don't think that's ALL there is to know, do you???

[statemachine]

You missed your calling phylo.You should have been a copper.

[Frederick L Clemens]

Very impressive research, Phylo. I wonder though if you aren't getting into a little overkill here.

The point for me was to determine if the WW2 stuff that Harker was publishing was legit or not - and then to expose it as false once it was determined to be so. Issues like his family life, credit history, etc. are quite irrelevant to me and I had assumed they would be irrelevant to the Feldgrau forum.

I bring this up as a reminder that we all have dirty underwear in some form or another. I am all for exposing charlatans in the area of WW2 history, but I don't want to get into their shorts.

That Harker pulled the same trick in another area of history is the only thing I see that is of interest in that sense.

[stcamp]

Ah Phylo,

I would not be happy about having you on my case.

I agree with Mr. Clemens. You have undressed him as a WWII expert. Lets not kneecap him virtually. Not really sporting.

Steve

[phylo_roadking]

Indeed. Though I was happy to find out that at the very least Mister Harker has not managed to PROFIT by his lies. And I thought people who might have been concerned that their hard-earned dollars they'd given to Paul K. Harker had gone to swell the coffers of some strange right-wing neo-Nazi grouping would have wanted to know that they haven't contributed to the rise of the Fourth Reich

I have no interest in publishing any more of the sick and sorry tale that I've uncovered EXCEPT what impinges on our subject. The VERY sad thing however, is the degree to which Paul Kenneth Harker decided to mix his fantasies and life with his attempts to defraud us. You would, all of you, be QUITE amazed as the remarkable fantasy and real-life world of the man who at the end of it to date decided to create these two books. SUffice it to say - Frederick, you were QUITE right up the thread when you mentioned possible psychological problems. There's no mere "possible" about it!

However, without playing the man - there IS something WE can all do about "Directive 19" and Honor "Denied"...

When we embarked on this voyage some time ago, we were faced with a major problem - ALL we could do was expose the fraud. Normal citizens like all of us are of course powerless to ensure fakes like these two books are withdrawn from the market, aren't we...? If books keep selling, no matter that WE have been smart enough to track down all the lies and misrepresentations and falsehoods - what else CAN we do??? We're only 'umble human beings, and can't really do much about persuading the likes of Amazon to withdraw them if Paul Harker won't, can we? We're left in our ivory towers, we can't do much in the real world to actually DO anything with our knowledge, can we? If you think about it - we're REALLY powerless; ALL we're doing here is shining a light on the fakes and lies within our own little community...

Frankly - I HATE being so powerless. It's NOT just about history; we're consumers, it's OUR money and the desire to part us from it that has led to a scam like this...and I'm QUITE sure SO many others out there. We as individuals simply can't afford to sue the likes of Mister Harker for Misrepresentation and Personation - and there's not enough of us to even think about uttering the words "Class Action", not with the costs of litigation in the US

So - beyond this, we're stymied...

OR ARE WE???

What if the Internet could offer you ALL as individuals the chance to actually DO something about "Directive 19" and "Honor Denied"? What if...in THIS ONE CASE at least - you simply don't HAVE to be powerless? What if there was something you could actually DO in this case, something totally anonymous to Mister Harker...in fact it doesn't involve contacting him or anyone to do with him or his life in ANY way...IT'S JUST ABOUT THE BOOKS - AND IT'S FREE??? All it requires is five minutes of your time, a PC, an Internet connection and the ability to string three words together...which we all here have...

What's more it's positively LEGAL and above board...and actually something actively ENCOURAGED by the US Government...

And no, it has nothing to do with IRS - it's to do with your rights as CONSUMERS to buy safely in the marketplace - and if publishing a fraudulent book like "Directive 19" or Honor Denied" as genuine when it simply isn't, isn't a case of Consumer Protection - I've never seen one...

[phylo_roadking]

http://www.ftc.gov/index.shtml

https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/

Consumer Power.

Paul K. Harker wrote these fantasies - then put a PRICE on the back cover and tried to SELL them...thereby leaving himself open to ALL the consumer protection laws and legislation of the nation in which he published them

Empower yourselves

[Paddy Keating]

I think Phylo is entirely justified in grinding this particular sh1theel several new orifices and, to quote a sticker I used to see on motorcycles back in the early 1970s, if you have to ask why, then you probably wouldn't understand.

Walt...bully...Holocaust profiteer-cum-exploiter...revisionist...charlatan...slanderer...etc etc etc...

Nah, he asked for it. What is disturbing is the apparent ease with which these people can put books into the flow with no checks and balances. Amazon, for instance, joins Paypal and other shyster organisations in my lexicon of bad people as a result of this Harker thing.

PK

[Michael Miller / ABR]

Keep up the good work, Phylo. He deserves every bit of [lawful] vilification/damnation that can be thrown his way.

Sincerely,
~ Mike

[Frederick L Clemens]

This case has been full of surprising twists and turns - and it has aroused a certain amount of justified indigation along the way. I think though that it is time to step back and place it all in perspective.

1) Harker has put out two books which are bogus.
2) The books by themselves are not expensive and, as far as I know, have not sold all that many copies.
3) There is information to suggest that Harker has a number of personal problems.

So, the bottom line is there are a few people out there who have lost a few bucks on a couple of bad books. Harker isn't getting rich from the books and "historical truth" is not being threatened to any measurable degree.

In fact, Third Reich historical research and militaria collecting are rife with examples of ripoffs which far exceed anything which the Harker case represents and rarely is there any justice. I just got back a few days ago from Germany where I effectively lost more money in one estate deal than Harker could possibly ever make from his books. I could lose sleep trying to get back at the charlatan who raped me on the items I bought, but I'd rather move on with the project for which I bought the items. It's been the nature of the Third Reich playing field, but forums like this one help to balance out the negative.

I have no interest in hounding Harker anymore over a couple of $25 books. In fact, in view of his personal problems, I wish him well and hope that he gets things sorted out. I think Harker is smart enough to be an asset to the community rather than a competitor, if he chooses to do so.

[phylo_roadking]

I have no interest in hounding Harker anymore over a couple of $25 books

I agree. There's no point in hounding the person, nor has there ever been. But now the person knows that there's NO lie he perpetrates regarding Reich history (ahahahaha) that will go undiscovered. All the readers of this thread have been given the huge canon of facts regarding his misadventure, ways of seeing for themselves when he's playing on our front lawn, and things they can do for themselves to stop him. How many of us with questions in the past about a Guy Sajer or a David Irving could do that???

The moral of this tale is what I said a few posts above; People Power. The Internet has created a whole new world - a world where there is NO slack in the system where "you can fool all of the people some of the time". You don't have to lift a phone and maybe discuss with a couple of people you can reach or KNOW to reach, or wait for an editorial review in a newspaper, or if the thing gathers worldwide momentum...maybe two minutes in a magazine programme on a minority-interest television channel. Woohoo...

NOW however - we can reach our peers virtually instantly. We can swap opinions and views...and evidence and proof...in realtime, tens or hundreds or thousands of us. Once upon a time, the sheer timelag between the publication of something like "Directive 19" and "Honor Denied"...and the fraud being revealed...meant that X number of people would STILL shell out their hard-earned readies in the meantime.

But nowadays - someone like Paul Harker, setting out to deceive and weave wicked webs, needs to remember something...

the truth of a thing will move around the world just as fast...if not faster...than the lies can

[Frederick L Clemens]

All well and good in a perfect world where everyone is rational and has rational responses.

This isn't a perfect world, however, and people are not machines that react in predictable ways. When a person is broken you don't keep kicking that person to make him work right again.

These same tools of internet power can be aimed at you just as well as you can aim them at others. And there are more traditional tools of power that remain available as well.

You did well in discovering the truth, but it is time to consider what the truth means. In this case, I believe that the truth shows that the actor involved is not his own master and that it is wiser to call it a day on this topic.

[phylo_roadking]

All well and good in a perfect world where everyone is rational and has rational responses.

Again - true. But it means that when the rational amongst us are looking for rational responses to an irrational situation - then we can get them far more readily than in the past

people are not machines that react in predictable ways

This I'm not sure about...the events of the last months have made me question that!!! You would be amazed how predictable the party of the first part has been...almost to the sweep of the stopwatch hand...

In this case, I believe that the truth shows that the actor involved is not his own master

Unfortunately I know the opposite to be true Just as an example - it's a common misconception to assume that in all circumstances just because someone is "under the doctor" or in counselling...that they are not responsible for their actions. Paul may live in a dreamworld...and I know JUST how much of a dreamworld but that has no relevance here...BUT he has very intentionally created it. There's no clinical lack of responsibility....just the plain irresponsibility of a pathological liar.

This is someone who was brought up hearing every day "'people believe what they want to believe", and "it's only illegal if you get caught". And I do believe it shows; it took root 100% and early.

[Frederick L Clemens]

I'd feel more comfortable with your prodding and poking if he was your neighbor, not mine.

[phylo_roadking]

I'd feel more comfortable with your prodding and poking if he was your neighbor, not mine

Don't worry - even for a neighbour it's not going to be waterpistols at dawn; this would require a certain degree of courage that happens to be lamentably lacking...

If there was any, we wouldn't have the sockpuppets, after all...