Obersturmführer Horst von Reichardt?

heinz kling · Post by **heinz kling** » Sat May 24, 2003 8:36 am

He claims to be a Panther commander in the Hitlerjugend, then a Königstiger company commander and ended the war as a Das Reich member fighting under Skorzeny.

Any truth to it?

See link http://www.hitlerjugend.net/hans.html

Timo · Post by **Timo** » Sat May 24, 2003 3:08 pm

Hmmm, strange. John Moore doesn't list him at all at the "Führerliste der Waffen-SS". It's save to assume that his name could not be found in any BA-MA, WASt or BDC-file.

heinz kling · Post by **heinz kling** » Sat May 24, 2003 5:13 pm

Until proven otherwise, that he's a fake and the photo of him as a HJ soldier a touch up job.

Timo · Post by **Timo** » Sun May 25, 2003 12:06 pm

From the above mentioned website:

Obersturmfuhrer von Reichardt was trained in the Adolf Hitler Schule in Berlin as well as the Officer Training School at Bad Tolz. After graduating from Bad Tolz as an Unterstrumfuhrer in the Waffen SS

From an email from John Moore:

1. There is no Horst Reicher, Reichart, Reichert, Raichert, etc listed in
the lists of Junkerschule Tölz graduating classes post-1942. Since the web
page says he attended Tölz, he could not have been a transfer from the army.
2. There are no similar names to be found in the BDC microfilm.

Also, from the same website:

After the Battle of the Bulge, he regrouped at Sennerlager where he took over command of a Kompanie of King Tiger Tanks (Konigstiger). He was then posted to 2.SS Das Reich. He fought under Sturmbannfuhrer Otto Skorzeny in Budapest. After the fall of Budapest he and his Kompanie surrendered to General Pattons 3rd Army in Czechslovakia.

The article about Horst von Reichardt also shows the following photo:

With the caption:

Budapest 1945. Horst is seated in the turret of Konigstiger 200; Second from the left.

ButI've asked Timm Haasler, who replies in an email:

The picture of 200 is a picture showing s. Pz.Abt. 503 in Oct. 1944 during Operation Margarethe.

Debica Fusilier · Post by **Debica Fusilier** » Sun May 25, 2003 3:41 pm

Further...how could anyone tell who is in the turret? The faces aren't very detailed.

C. Udentz · Post by **C. Udentz** » Mon May 26, 2003 12:41 am

Abend,

Interesting.

But the photo is indistinct. I have seen it many times before. Not much to see even with enhancement programs.

C. Udentz.

Timo · Post by **Timo** » Mon May 26, 2003 3:35 am

No matter who is in the turret, it's the wrong unit and the wrong timeframe. Thus it can't be him (apart from the fact that he isn't listed in any file as a graduate from Tölz)

It's a hoax, until proven otherwise

Josef Hahne · Post by **Josef Hahne** » Tue May 27, 2003 9:15 pm

Guys,
He is no hoax, the photo is not retouched, and it is him sitting in the Kdr hatch of the Konigstiger in Budapest. His name has been changed to protect his identity from those in the world that would still love to see him 6 feet under prematurely. After the war, he spent several months in Flossenberg as a POW/war criminal watching his kameraden die from typhus and starvation.
Oh BTW, in the Budapest photo he and his crew were on loan to Feldenhalle from Das Reich.
Feel free to ask pointed questions and I will get replies from him to post. He is not bashfull about telling all who he is and which unit he fought for but I protect him all the idiots out there because the man is like a father to me.

Josef

Timo · Post by **Timo** » Tue May 27, 2003 11:02 pm

Hallo Josef,

Thanks for your email and your reply here. Off course it explains why his name can't be found on the graduation lists, but I still have some question marks regarding the timeframe problem mentioned above. Do you mean he was temporarily attached to 503 in Budapest in October 1944 when the rest of the Das Reich Division was refitting in the west? Because the caption on your website says Budapest 1945.

Josef Hahne · Post by **Josef Hahne** » Wed May 28, 2003 6:43 am

Timo,
Here are a few bits from his book regaurding dates and places.
ABSOLUTLY NONE FOR THIS LIST

Josef

Marko · Post by **Marko** » Wed May 28, 2003 8:41 am

Just some of my observations:

...On Jan 2, 1945 Hitlerjugend Div. was ordered to pull out ...After two days, training was ended and they were shipped via rail to Budapest that evening. The trip should have taken 3 days but they had priority routing. Once off loaded, he was sent to the Das Reich Division in Plattensee. He now belonged to the Das Reich Division...

The first order to pull the Waffen-SS divisions out of the Ardennes was issued on 7 January.
DR was finally pulled out on 17 January but the first elements (VP) didn't arrive in Hungary before February (the transport of the main body began on 8 February). When the division arrived it was stationed at Raab (Györ) about 100 km north of Platensee.

...remove his Hitlerjugend Cuffband

All SS-soldiers had to remove their cuff-bands when they arrived to Hungary.

...Once in Budapest he found his commanding Oficer was Otto Skorzeny...

On 31 January Hitler personally awarded Skorzeny with the Ehrenblattspange, I don't know the exact whereabouts of Skorzeny in January but he most certainly wasn't in Budapest and at the end of the month he and his unit was sent to Schwedt (Oderfront).

Also Budapest was surrounded on 24 December 1944 and Op. Südwind (HJ&LSSAH) was the only operation where the 6.PzArmy units participated before the Op. Frühlingserwachen in March.

Anyone care to comment?
Marko

Josef Hahne · Post by **Josef Hahne** » Wed May 28, 2003 11:40 am

I will not go on to "defend" every single bit of written down memories that I posted. I posted it to supply his recollections to where he was, what he was doing, and who he was fighting with at the time. This was for everyone on the list to enjoy and read, not to be publically picked apart. If you want to pick apart word for word, knock yourself out, but first read and understand what I wrote before blasting back a half cocked response. If you do not know where Skorzeny was during the month of january 1945, how the hell can you say he most certainly was not in Budapest? So, you say Budpest was surrounded in October of 1944, how was it that it lasted untill the middle of February and was still reinforced with men and material until the end of January?

On December 31, 1944, Skorzeny met with Hitler at Ziegenhain. At this point Hitler informed Skorzeny of the new major campaign in the east. Shortly afterward, he returned to Budapest.
According to Skorzeny's book "Special Missions" he was at a place he calls "Friedenthal" on January 30. 1945. He mentions Friedenthal constantly during his tenure as Overseer at Budapest. In the days following Jan 30, he travelled north to Schwedt to establish a bridgehead there. Pest fell to the Russians on 18 January 1945. Buda fell on Feb 11 after the remaining forces dis-obeyed Hitler's orders to fight until the last man and broke out from the city.

"Horst" was sent to Budapest basically as soon as he arrived in Plattensee because of his experiance and combat training with the heavy Panzers. I did not say Das Reich was sent to Budapest. Feldenhalle needed experianced tanker to man the defence of the city so "Horst" was sent to them. Basically, he was a warm body that knew how to command the equipment that was already there.

This list is supposed to be the "gentleman's" WW2 discussion list. I find less back biting and blather on the Wehrmacht list.

Then you probably wonder why not too many German veterans come foward to tell of their experiances. After reading some of this nonsence crap, it should really not be too hard to figure out why they keep to themselves.

Josef

Timo · Post by **Timo** » Wed May 28, 2003 11:47 am

Josef, no offense, but it is normal to discuss everything odd you find in veterans memories. Be it to unmask imposters or to help them to correct mistakes. In my contacts with veterans of SS-AA1 this is a very common procedure as, just as you pointed out, after 60 years the human brain is far from perfect. Due to constant discussion and double checking their stories we (myself and fellow researchers) managed to help them remember details they otherwise never would have brought back. Only last week this was the case with a former Oscha. who was misquoted in some major works about the Ardennes.

Again, no offense

Josef Hahne · Post by **Josef Hahne** » Wed May 28, 2003 11:57 am

Timo,
I have no quarrel with you and your questions. It was you that contacted me to ask about "Horst's" identity. I wonder how long this subject would have droned on for if it were not for you contacting me to ask for a clarification. If I knew you better, I would have no problem releasing his real name to you so you coul do the reserch on him. I would love to hear what you came up with. The truth is, "Horst" is almost too naive about talking to anyone about what he did and where he currently lives. I fear that his name and location would fall into the wrong hands and he would be persecuted for the rest of his days. Initially, he told me to use his real name on the website but his wife hit the moon when she found out. As you can see by the link you already know his first name, it is Hans.
The questions I have a problem with are the ones that are accusetory in nature and not based on fact. Marco does not want to believe what I posted but his questions are not really based on what I had wriiten.
If all of this seems very "cloak and dagger" I appologize but my only consern is that his reputation and memories are not dragged through the mud and that his identity remains a secret. I'm sorry but it just has to be this way.
Josef

Post by **John P. Moore** » Wed May 28, 2003 9:54 pm

A number of serious researchers use this forum as a source of new information. Anyone posting data associated with a fictitous name needs to clearly indicate that the name is false. This will avoid the expenditure of time and energy in an attempt to verify information that was false to begin with. It was only natural that Timo would seek to verify that person`s identity.

Feldgrau.net

Obersturmführer Horst von Reichardt?

Obersturmführer Horst von Reichardt?

My feeling

Oberstumführer Horst von Reichhart?

False Names/Hoaxes