Was this the furthest east German forces advanced?

German campaigns and battles 1919-1945.

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Was this the furthest east German forces advanced?

Postby Nebelwerfer » Tue Feb 01, 2005 8:59 pm

A veteran told me he was a young lieutenant with Von Kleist's staff when this commander reached the Caspian Sea near oil-rich Baku.

The veteran also said that a Kriegsmarine unit rolled up in their pristine blue trucks carrying boats that were to be used to cross the Caspian and make contact with friendlies in Iran.

Was this the furthest east German forces advanced?
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Postby Jason Pipes » Tue Feb 01, 2005 9:09 pm

Elements of the 16.Infanterie-Division (mot) reached the farthest east. While south of Stalingrad, the 16.Infanterie-Division (mot) helped to cover the lines between the 1.Panzer-Armee and the 4.Panzer-Armee. While located in this region, Aufkälrung-Abteilung 341 managed to push the farthest eastward of any German unit during WWII, pushing to within 20 miles of Astrakhan along the delta of the Caspian Sea. Some elements of the unit are reported to have made it even closer than this!
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Postby sid guttridge » Mon Feb 07, 2005 6:24 am

Hi Nebelwerfer and Jason,

16th Motorised Infantry Division is interesting for another reason - it was the only army formation to begin the war as an ordinary infantry division, continue as a motorised and then panzer-grenadier division and finish it as 116th Panzer Division.

Cheers,

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Postby Enrico Cernuschi » Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:36 am

The boats who had to sail on the Caspian Sea were surface attack crafts of the Italian Decima Flottiglia MAS. The lorries of the Flotilla in Russia were coming directly from Italy and were, actually, painted in blue.

Bye EC
Ciàpla adasi, stà léger.
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Postby Marko » Mon Feb 07, 2005 5:36 pm

Very interesting, Enrico. Two short follow up questions:

Since they didn't manage to get to the Caspian Sea how far did they get and were they manned by Italian crews?

16th Motorised Infantry Division is interesting for another reason - it was the only army formation to begin the war as an ordinary infantry division, continue as a motorised and then panzer-grenadier division and finish it as 116th Panzer Division.


Not quite, Sid. 16th Infantry Division was upgraded to 16th Panzer Division in summer 1940, though it did provide some elements for the formation of a "new" 16th Infantry Division (mot.).
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Postby sid guttridge » Tue Feb 08, 2005 3:45 am

Hi Marko,

That makes 16th Infantry Division even more remarkable, if it spawned not one but TWO panzer divisions!

Cheers,

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Postby Paul_9686 » Tue Feb 08, 2005 11:43 am

As an aside, Rolf Stoves, in his History of the 1st Panzer Division, says that the staff of I/Pz. Rgt. 1 and cadres from the 3rd, 4th, and 6th companies were used to form the 16th (motorized) Infantry Division's Panzer Abteilung 116 in the early spring of 1942.

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farthest east

Postby Leica_R » Tue Feb 08, 2005 3:26 pm

An account of the trip to Astrakhan at http://216.198.255.120/germanpart/astrachan.htm

It must have been really something, the sight of 8 wheeled armored cars in the land of double humped camels...
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Postby Benoit Douville » Wed Feb 09, 2005 3:06 pm

What an amazing feet indeed by the German Army to reach that far. I think that a German Patrol cut the Baku-Astrakahn rail line in 1942, and it was the furthest extension point south east of the German Army.

We should not forget also that the Gebirgs Division did put the Nazi Flag was on top of Mt-Elbrus on August 21 1942.

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Postby Marko » Tue Feb 15, 2005 2:53 pm

That makes 16th Infantry Division even more remarkable, if it spawned not one but TWO panzer divisions!


But there was also a third division - 6th Panzer 8) .

As an aside, Rolf Stoves, in his History of the 1st Panzer Division, says that the staff of I/Pz. Rgt. 1 and cadres from the 3rd, 4th, and 6th companies were used to form the 16th (motorized) Infantry Division's Panzer Abteilung 116 in the early spring of 1942.


Yes, I think they were very lucky to get such a great team of officers and soldiers - Tebbe, Bunzel, Weißflog, Schulenburg. However, in this respect the 16th Inf.Div.(mot.) was no different than the other Motorized Inf.Div. taking part in Operation Blau.
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