Freedom Betrayed by Herbert Hoover

[panzermahn]

Hello folks



http://www.amazon.com/Freedom-Betrayed- ... d_sim_b_21

From the reviews, it seems that this book (published more than 50 years after the death of the author) by the ex-president of United States gave a different interpretation about Roosevelt and his statemanship that brought United Statthes to war..

Guess this book's viewpoints would contradict the established historical model of WW2, the first time a revisionist history has been written by a former US president

Panzermahn

[Jukka Juutinen]

Based on the excerpts, this is going to be a superb book! I will be buying my copy soon. By the way, there is a 50-minute video on youtube on which the editor, George Nash gives a presentation on the book and Hoover a couple of months ago at some public venue.

[Jukka Juutinen]

OK, the book is now in my hands I have read the first 200 pages or so (in total, nearly 1100 pages). The book begins with a 120-page introduction by the editor George Nash. He first gives a glimpse on who Hoover was and then moves on to the genesis of the book; why Hoover wrote it and the tortuous process that went into it. Then he describes how he edited the book.

So far, Hoover's text shreds Roosevelt and his politics apart. This is indeed a refreshing perspective among the Rooseveltian propaganda that still affects so many even today.

To me even Hoover seems to suffer from a very typical illness affecting Americans: a fanatical belief in the ultimate superiority of "the American way of life". And whenever an advocate of a society that is based on consumerism criticizes another ideology for "materialism", I don't know whether to laugh or weep...

Fuller report when I have finished the book!

[John P. Moore]

Jukka Juutinen said below,

a very typical illness affecting Americans: a fanatical belief in the ultimate superiority of "the American way of life". And whenever an advocate of a society that is based on consumerism criticizes another ideology for "materialism", I don't know whether to laugh or weep...

As an American I find such inflammatory off-topic comments to be particularly offensive and feel they have no place here on Feldgrau. Despite whatever imperfections in American society that some may perceive, people like Jukka Juutinen should never forget the sacrifice in lives and capital made by the USA during World War II and the early post-war years that prevented the world from falling under the murderous tyranny of the Nazis and Communism.

John Moore

[Jukka Juutinen]

Yes, indeed I should keep clear in mind that the U. S. actively helped the USSR in its attempts to crush Finland, a country far more democratic than the U. S. has ever been. Yes sir, I will never forget. Nor forgive.

[Jukka Juutinen]

Mr. Moore, two simple questions: since you have met numerous German WW2 veterans:
-did they feel they were "servants of murderous tyranny"?
-did you call them servants of tyranny face-to-face?

[lwd]

Yes, indeed I should keep clear in mind that the U. S. actively helped the USSR in its attempts to crush Finland,

Did it? I'd like to see some documentation on that.

a country far more democratic than the U. S. has ever been.

Again an opinion lacking support or even a clear defintion.

Yes sir, I will never forget. Nor forgive.

That's your problem.

[Jukka Juutinen]

lwd, Roosevelt's administration continued trading with the USSR during the Winter War. And as even Hoover's book mention, F. D. R.'s administration signed in 1933 a treaty fully "legalizing" Stalin's regime from the U. S. point of view. Hoover mentions how his attempts to provide help to Finland was routinely undermined by F.D.R.

During the Continuation War e.g. Soviet air force units employed against Finland had significant amount of equipment of American combat aircraft freely given to Stalin's regime, a murderous regime as defined by John Moore. Many Finnish veterans recall how they encountered Soviet soldiers with American made boots and food supplies, again freely given to the Soviets.

All this balanced to the fact that when Finland requested arms during the Winter War, U. S. refused any materiel help and the meager supplies we could obtain were materiel that were declared obsolete (like model 1897 guns...) and even then they had to purchased (not for free like the arms supplies to Stalin) for inflated market prices.

As for democracy, Finland has never been a racially segregated society, which the US was during the war. Here every person over 18 is eligible to vote without any need to specifically register. Yes, if democracy is defined as people's say in a country's politics, then we were more democratic (e.g. according to Hoover's book 80 % of US population opposed entering the war). I do grant that as of now, the situation may well have reversed as the last 20 years have seen a significant loss of democracy in Finland.

But during the period of FDR's admin, Finland was definitely more democratic than the U. S. And especially far more democratic than the USSR supported by F.D.R.

[Tom Houlihan]

Stop.

This thread is about the book, not about anyone's opinion of US history or their attitudes 70 years ago. Keep this thread on teh book.

If you wish to discuss any failure of the US to aid Finland at any time, start a new thread.

By this time tomorrow, this and all other off-topic posts in this thread will be removed.

Let's keep it civil, Gentlemen.

[Jukka Juutinen]

Tom, not a problem for me. However, some leeway should be allowable as the book is about US foreign policy in WW2 written by an ex-POTUS, and the very reason why Hoover wrote the book is that he felt that the US lost statemanship during FDR's administration.