Should Germany join the United States as a superpower?

august · Post by **august** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 12:00 pm

With her strong economy, industrious and gregarious people, and new world vision; why shouldn't Germany strive to become a superpower? Certainly it is possible, but would the world accept it?

Kucirek · Post by **Kucirek** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 12:09 pm

Possible? Alone? How? Given the recent votes in the Bundesländer, advancing the far right, I doubt that the Germans share your view on the strong, industrious Germany.

The only way Germany will become a superpower is as part of the EU - which I would gladly like to see, as a - more or less - idealistic EU could balance American realistic foreign policy and, hopefully, give the UN more credibility. But even if the EU could become a superpower the countries of Europa are still too divided and narrow-minded, seeing only what their EU partners receive instead of thinking of the contribution to the EU as a whole. Until such tribal tendencies subside there won't be a EU superpower with superpower cabalities.

VonderSaar · Post by **VonderSaar** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 12:14 pm

august wrote:With her strong economy, industrious and gregarious people, and new world vision; why shouldn't Germany strive to become a superpower? Certainly it is possible, but would the world accept it?

To be a superpower Germany needed nuclear weapons. But that never would be allowed from ohter countries. especialy not from israel

(joke)

greenhorn · Post by **greenhorn** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 12:26 pm

I think the German economy is in a bit of a slump at the moment and there's still more pain to come IMO, in the light of the next tranche of funds heading to the East to help it's restructuring.

august · Post by **august** » Thu Oct 07, 2004 12:36 pm

i agree with your assessment concerning the eu. in addition to ending nationalistic bickering, europes should strengthen its ties with the united states. the current situation would improve greatly with bush out of the white house. as for israel, there is growing concern over the outrageous financial and carte blanc political support that country has been given .

wasp · Post by **wasp** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 3:53 am

Hello kucirek

I don't know mate, tribal differences? I don't speak danish and i doubt you speak dutch. At least in the US of A they all speak the same language (not talking about accents and dialects). Look even in belgium we start fights over language. I fear that if it doesn't work here it won't work for the whole of europe.

grtzzzzzz

Tom Houlihan · Post by **Tom Houlihan** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 4:34 am

I've been mulling over this in my mind since I read this yesterday. In my humble opinion, the European nations will not allow Germany to become a superpower.

I just finished reading Jackboot, which told the story of the German soldier from 1713-1945. I learned a lot about old Prussian, and how literally centuries of training have been drummed into the German psyche.

I would expect that there are still those who fear (outside Germany) or anticipate (inside Germany) that Deutschland will again attempt to gain dominance over Europe. Whether that fear be real or imagined, I would say that it's probably strong enough for nations to band together in overt or covert ways to keep Germany from working her way up to the top of the heap.

Then again, I'm an American. How in the hell can I understand (truly) how Europeans of any nation think???

Qvist · Post by **Qvist** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 5:04 am

As far as I can see, Germany does not have the potential to become a superpower - compared to the United States, she is in every sense a second-rate power. The European Union is a different matter, at least if we are talking purely in terms of material potential.

cheers

Stefan · Post by **Stefan** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 7:37 am

And just another incredibly silly and extremely superfluous "topic". *Yawn*

Dackel Staffel · Post by **Dackel Staffel** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 8:31 am

Tom wrote: Then again, I'm an American. How in the hell can I understand (truly) how Europeans of any nation think???

Hi Tom,

Did anybody do it once ? Your question works on the two continents. Doesn't one say that americans and englishmen belong to the same people only divided by their language.

So long.

Reb · Post by **Reb** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 10:14 am

The real question is "why would any country want to be a superpower?"

As an American, I don't take any pride or joy in that - I don't wish to boss others around, police the world or butt into other's business. But my own leaders and yes, other countries, are always saying I should. "The Americans should do something" to which I say, "why?" Every time
we get involved in someone else's business our own freedoms corrode a bit more.

As a simple citizen I can tell you what I gain from superpower status: Sweet bugger all. Although I do get to pay for it.

Plus half the world is mad at us at any one time. I hate it when people are mad at me...

cheers
Reb

I think I'd rather trade with other countries, maintain a strong defense and only use it for that, defense. Being a superpower is for the birds.

Michate · Post by **Michate** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 11:18 am

God may save us (and I am a German) from another German attempt to become a superpower.

Dackel Staffel · Post by **Dackel Staffel** » Fri Oct 08, 2004 11:46 am

Michate wrote:God may save us (and I am a German) from another German attempt to become a superpower.

But for the football world cup in 2006

Kucirek · Post by **Kucirek** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 2:58 am

wasp wrote:Hello kucirek

I don't know mate, tribal differences? I don't speak danish and i doubt you speak dutch. At least in the US of A they all speak the same language (not talking about accents and dialects). Look even in belgium we start fights over language. I fear that if it doesn't work here it won't work for the whole of europe.

grtzzzzzz

I agree. The EU is a vast task. What I mean by tribal is the notion that states/humans have a - egoistic self-preserving - tendency to focus on their own spoils relative to other states instead of focusing on the absolute gain for the whole union. For instance, a Danish farmer may become infuriated by the amount of subsidies lent to Spanish agriculture. While it may not improve the economic situation for the Danish farmer, it will improve the economy of the EU as a whole. This is of course a very oversimplified example, but I hope you get my meaning. The tribal divide is simply one of envy. And although I agree with you that is an almost insurmountable task to bring ideals to the populations of Europa it must be done if their is to be a common Europa in the future. And of course it won't be accomplished overnight. Writing something about ideals and common history etc. in a new constitution is still just words, even moreso on a continent plagued by extreme nationalism. I think the only way of forging a EU is by - idealistic - politicians working for a federal ideal to push their policy through, and then, with time, maybe the populations will gradually take it in. It might take a couple of generations (thereby also furthering integration naturally, mixing the populations), it might take a 100 years, but it is absolutely necessary that it be accomplished. As feuding fools we fight, while the tide of greater conflict is upon us.

sid guttridge · Post by **sid guttridge** » Sat Oct 09, 2004 4:07 am

Hi Guys,

Might I suggest that as people claiming German descent form the largest single group in the one existing super power and the wider Anglo-Saxon pseudo-continent is still largely of more distant Germanic origin, that Germans, in the widest sense, already are a superpower. However, its capital is in Washington, not Berlin.

Cheers,

Sid.

Feldgrau.net

Should Germany join the United States as a superpower?

Should Germany join the United States as a superpower?

Re: Should Germany join the United States as a superpower?