Hitler's high seas fleet

German Kriegsmarine 1935-1945.

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The German 'Z-plan' -vs- The US Warship construction

Postby nebelwerferXXX » Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:32 pm

nebelwerferXXX wrote:The RM 33-billion German 'Z-Plan'
(a) Six battleships of 56,000 tons;
(b) Two battleships (Bismarck and Tirpitz) of 42,000 tons;
(c) Three pocket-battleships of 31,000 tons, mounting 15-inch guns, with Scharnhorst and Gneisenau
converted from 11-inch to 15-inch;
(d) Three pocket-battleships (Deutschland, Admiral Scheer, Graf Spee);
(e) Two aircraft-carriers (Graf Zeppelin, launched in 1938, plus one other);
(f) Five heavy cruisers (Hipper, Blucher, Prinz Eugen, Seydlitz, Lutzow);
(g) 44 light cruisers (of which six were already completed);
(h) 68 destroyers and 90 torpedo-boats;
(i) Some 249 U-boats-coastal, sea-going, and ocean-going.

source:
Hitler's high sea fleet


US Warship construction:
$ 40,734-million for Ships = RM 101.835-Billion (or equivalent to more than 3 times of the German 'Z-plan')
---105 carriers (inc. 17 ships, Essex-Class)(inc. 9 ships, Independence-Class)
---25 battleships (inc. 4 ships, Iowa-Class)
---100 cruisers (inc. 38 ships, Cleveland-Class)
---441 destroyers (inc. 176 ships, Fletcher-Class)

sources:
Atlas of World History, Volume 2
The Time Line of World War II
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Re: Hitler's high seas fleet

Postby lwd » Fri Nov 19, 2010 6:19 am

Quoteing yourself is usually considered a violation of etiquette on most boards. There are occasionally times when it makes sense. None of yours to date have.
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Re: Hitler's high seas fleet

Postby nebelwerferXXX » Sat Nov 20, 2010 5:12 am

Seven posts by lwd as of Nov 19, 2010 and counting...Thank You!
nebelwerferXXX
 

Re: Hitler's high seas fleet

Postby PVH » Wed Jan 05, 2011 1:24 am

nebelwerferXXX wrote:German 'Z-Plan'
(a) Six battleships of 56,000 tons;
(b) Two battleships (Bismarck and Tirpitz) of 42,000 tons;
(c) Three pocket-battleships of 31,000 tons, mounting 15-inch guns, with Scharnhorst and Gneisenau
converted from 11-inch to 15-inch;
(d) Three pocket-battleships (Deutschland, Admiral Scheer, Graf Spee);
(e) Two aircraft-carriers (Graf Zeppelin, launched in 1938, plus one other);
(f) Five heavy cruisers (Hipper, Blucher, Prinz Eugen, Seydlitz, Lutzow);
(g) Forty-four light cruisers (of which six were already completed);
(h) Sixty-eight destroyers and ninety torpedo-boats;
(i) Some 249 U-boats-coastal, sea-going, and ocean-going.

source:
Hitler's high sea fleet...Richard Humble


nebelwerferXXX,
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that the Scharnhorst had not been refitted with 15" guns and went down with the 11" guns which were originally installed.
Best,
PVH
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Re: Hitler's high seas fleet

Postby lwd » Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:59 am

Well he mentions it's part of the plan and not that it was done. Of course it wasn't really part of the Z plan although it was considered and rejected.
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Re: Hitler's high seas fleet

Postby PVH » Wed Jan 05, 2011 2:01 pm

lwd,
I see. Thanks for the quick reply.
Best,
PVH
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Re: Hitler's high seas fleet

Postby Tiornu » Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:17 pm

Scharnhorst's switch-over was actually an elaborate affair as it added roughly 1000 tons of armament weight. The turrets required increased structural support, and the bow had to be lengthened by 10m. The international situation wasn't such that the ships could be easily docked for the conversion. The 15in guns were ordered, I believe, but they were instead earmarked for "O" class battlecruisers (they would be the 31,000-ton pocket battleships in the list). There were also twelve other pocket battleships, c22,000 tons with six 28cm gun. I don't think any orders were placed for them. The "O" class largely supplanted them, but no construction took place for either class.
Scharnhorst was sunk with her original armament. Gneisenau began converting during repairs for her severe bomb damage, but she didn't get very far before war's end when she was scuttled.
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Re: Hitler's high seas fleet

Postby lwd » Tue Jan 11, 2011 5:27 am

Interesting I hadn't realized that they actually planned on making the conversion of one of them anyway. Thanks for the info.
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