Largest Post World War One Polish Battle

German Freikorps, Reichsheer and Reichsmarine 1919-1934.

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Postby Hans » Fri Sep 09, 2005 3:54 pm

Quite the opposite Torquez. I am saying there is no such thing as blood or nationality. As for culture, what in the hell is that supposed to be?

Hi Ada,
The original occupiers of Australia have been trying to get rid of us invaders for two centuries. The thing is not to get too excited about these things. When you're dead you are exactly what you have always been, nothing, so why bother. :D

- Hans
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Du deutsches Vaterland?
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Re: Largest Post World War One Polish Battle

Postby Domen123 » Thu Dec 24, 2009 5:41 pm

If it comes to Greater Poland Uprising - after-uprising combat reports say about 1714 dead, during the past 85 - 90 years due to research of different historians this number was of course constantly growing - modern data (2008) says about 2289 dead.

Of course this is about Polish losses - both combat and non-combat losses. There are 2284 men and 5 women among them. Over 130 surnames are unknown. 1100 out of these 2289 dead are confirmed to be KIA, almost 200 - DoW, over 110 - MIA, almost 200 - DoS, 30 - drowned and 1 - drunken to death. :D The exact cause of death of the remaining ca. 650 is unclear.

In February of 1919 forces of the Greater Poland Uprising numbered over 30,000 soldiers in frontline units equipped with over 25,000 rifles, 250 machine guns, 50,000 hand grenades and over 80 artillery guns. There were 2,000,000 rounds of ammo.

Soon after the end of the successful uprising (in late April / early May of 1919) Armia Wielkopolska (Army of Greater Poland) numbered yet some 70,000 soldiers and had got 12 rifle regiments, 2 cavalry brigades, 3 artillery regiments and strong Air Force (4 battalions), communication units, sappers and medical service. A lot of equipment was captured on Germans.

On 28 August of 1919 the Army of Greater Poland was incorporated into the structures of Wojsko Polskie (Polish Army).

There is probably no any data concerning German losses in the uprising, maybe except some estimations.

Soldiers of Greater Poland in trenches, January of 1919:

Image
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Re: Largest Post World War One Polish Battle

Postby Domen123 » Thu Dec 24, 2009 6:19 pm

Franciszek Ratajczak was the first Polish soldier to be KIA in the Greater Poland Uprising of 1918 - 1919:

Image

More photos of soldiers of Greater Poland during the uprising:
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Fighting is in progress - soldiers of Greater Poland
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Heavy machine gun of Greater Poland's insurgents in action
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Important Czarnkowski bridge captured from German hands by Greater Poland's soldiers
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Liberation of the village of Rosko, poviat Czarnkow-Trzcianka, from German hands by Armia Wielkopolska - February of 1919
powstwlkp4.jpg (77.25 KiB) Viewed 3014 times
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Re: Largest Post World War One Polish Battle

Postby Domen123 » Sun Jul 07, 2013 8:58 am

As for strength figures for opposing sides in the Third Silesian Uprising:

Polish forces:

Silesian POW - 40,000
Silesian volunteers - 20,000
Volunteers from outside of Silesia - 5,000

Total: 65,000

German forces:

Kampforganisation Oberschlesien (aka Selbstchutz) - 35,000
Volunteers - 15,000

Total: 50,000
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Re: Largest Post World War One Polish Battle

Postby Domen123 » Wed Jul 10, 2013 12:19 pm

A documentary about the Greater Poland Uprising with English subtitles:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6-poUU6Rac
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Re: Largest Post World War One Polish Battle

Postby Domen123 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 8:09 pm

And here the results of the Silesian plebiscite as well as statistics on Polish-speaking (first language) population:

A relatively large part of Upper Silesian Poles voted for Germany rather than for Poland in that 1921 plebiscite:

http://s14.postimg.org/nrkdssrch/1921_Plebiscyt_B.png

1921_Plebiscyt_B.png
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http://s3.postimg.org/dy5lxvtxv/Plebiscite_1921_B.png

Plebiscite_1921_B.png
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And % of "Polish votes" (votes for Polish lists) in 1919 municipal elections (data published by Karol Firich):

Oppeln Stadt - 7%
Gleiwitz Stadt - 24%
Kattowitz Stadt - 19%
Ratibor Stadt - 9,5%
Beuthen Stadt - 31,5%
Konigshutte - 41%
Leobschutz - no Polish list
Neustadt in OS - 28%
Ratibor - 62%
Kreuzburg* - 48%
Hindenburg - 75,5%
Kattowitz - 73%
Tarnowitz - 78%
Oppeln - 61%
Tost-Gleiwitz - 72%
Beuthen - 76%
Cosel - 46%
Gross Strehlitz - 70%
Lublinitz - 67%
Rybnik - 79%
Rosenberg - 56%
Pless - 85%
Namslau* - counted together with Kreuzburg

In some counties Polish lists got much bigger % of votes in 1919 elections, than was the % of votes for Poland there in 1921.

Among reasons why a relatively large percentage of Polish-speaking Upper Silesians voted for Germany were economic reasons, which told them: "stay in Germany - here you can earn more money than in Bolshevik-devastated Poland". The fact that so many Upper Silesians voted for Poland was still largely a "merit" of Bismarck and his persecutions of Polish language and of Catholicism.

In counties where majority of local Poles were Protestants, majority of votes during the 1921 plebiscite were for Germany. That's because Protestantism was not as persecuted by Bismarck as Catholicism, so hostility towards Germany did not grow there.

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The Silesian Plebiscite was a success for Poland compared to the East Prussian Plebiscite - check the link below:

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 0#p1852805

http://s11.postimg.org/ie5zvsrz7/Plebiscite_OP_1920.png

Plebiscite_OP_1920.png
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According to some sources, in total 13 municipalities voted mostly for Poland (3 in Kreis Osterode, 1 in Kreis Neidenburg, 3 in Kreis Allenstein, 1 in Kreis Roessel, 5 in Kreise Stuhm and Marienwerder). But most of them were enclaves surrounded by territories which voted for Germany. So only several border villages were given to Poland as the result of the plebiscite:

Villages given to Poland and percent of votes for Poland in 1920 in those villages:

Polish name / German name - % of votes for Poland in the plebiscite

Małe Pólko / Kleinfelde - 44%
Kramowo / Kramershof - 50%
Bursztych / Aussendeich - 79%
Janowo / Johannisdorf - 48%
Nowe Lignowy / Neu Liebenau - 58%
Lubstynek / Klein Lobenstein - 65% (93 votes for Poland, 51 for Germany)
Napromek / Gut Nappern - 51% (45 votes for Poland, 43 for Germany)
Groszki / Groschken - 93% (69 votes for Poland, 5 for Germany)

Henryk added:

henryk wrote:Re ethnic Poles voting for Germany in the plebiscites:
I recall an exhibition in a Museum in 1994, probably in Opole, which provided data which showed that a major reason for the German victories was due to non-resident Germans voting, ie born there but not resident.
For East Prussia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Prussian_plebiscite
After the vote, the Poles felt disadvantaged by the Versailles Treaty stipulation which enabled those who were born in the plebiscite area but not living there any more to return to vote. Approximately 152,000 such individuals participated in the plebiscite.[66] (66= Rhode, Gotthold. Die Ostgebiete des Deutschen Reiches, Holzner-Verlag Würzburg, 1956.)
Also claims of fraud and manipulation:
The German side tried to sway the voters in the area before the plebiscite using violence, Polish organisations and activists were harassed by German militias, and those actions included murder; the most notable example being the killing of Bogumił Linka a native Masurian member of the Polish delegation to Versailles, who supported vote for Poland; his death described as "bestial murder", after being brutally beaten by German militias armed with crowbars, metal rods, and shovels, his ribs were punctured by shovel, only barely alive and bleeding additionally from neck and head, he was taken to hospital where he died.[54][55] After his burial the grave of Linka was defiled.[56] Masurs who supported voting for Poland were singled out and subjected to terror and repressions.[57] Names of Masurs supporting Polish side were published in German newspapers, and their photos presented in German shops; afterwards a regular hunts were organised after them.[58] In the pursuit of Polish supporters the local Polish population was terrorized by German militias[59] Local "Gazeta Olsztyńska" wrote "Unspeakable terror lasted till the last days[of the plebiscite]"[60] At least 3,000 Warmian and Masurian activists who were engaged for Polish side had to flee the region out of fear of their lives.[61] German police engaged in active surveillance of Polish minority and attacks against Polish activists.[62]

Curiously the Wiki article on the Silesian plebiscites does not mention the non-resident vote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upper_Silesia_plebiscite


=================================

Polish newsreel from 1922 showing incorporation of part of Upper Silesia to Poland:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huGHkpTocWQ
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Re: Largest Post World War One Polish Battle

Postby Domen123 » Fri Feb 07, 2014 10:17 pm

Regarding discussion from previous pages (mostly German propaganda rants by Opa and his kind):

It seems that German propaganda started to count Kashubs and Mazurs as groups distinct from Poles only after 1850:

Territories with Polish majority in 1847:

Thin red line is the border between Prussian and Russian partition zones of Poland:

Image

Highlighted the boundaries of territories with Polish majority in 1847:

Image

This map still shows situation after 75 years of Prussian government-sponsored German colonization in partitioned Poland.

Legend to this map (in 1847 West Slavic groups such as "Kashubs" and "Mazurs" were unknown to Germans):

Image

The source of this "Polish propaganda map" is:

Image

==================================================

And here - to compare with situation in 1847 - language boundaries around year 1650:

Pink - Polish majority
Blue - German majority
Olive green - Prussian majority
Yellow - Sorbian majority
And also Lithuanian-speaking areas in the north-east.

Image

No "German strip" along the Vistula River ranging from Danzig in the north to Thorn in the south.

That "German strip" was created later - after 1650 and before 1850. Most likely between the First Partition and 1850.

=============================

Example of government-sponsored German colonization in occupied (partitioned) Poland during the 1800s:

Image
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Re: Largest Post World War One Polish Battle

Postby Domen123 » Sat Feb 08, 2014 6:05 am

It is interesting how many language / ethnic groups this map from 1847 has for Italy alone... 20:

Image

And in France there are even more because... 22 language / ethnic groups (10 South French and 12 North French).

On the other hand, this map knows no "Kashubs", "Silesians" or "Mazurs" - they are all counted as "Polaken".

German propaganda started to divide the Poles into several groups only after 1850, apparently.
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Re: Largest Post World War One Polish Battle

Postby Domen123 » Sat Feb 08, 2014 9:39 am

Here about Polonization of Germans throughout ages:

http://historum.com/european-history/57 ... tcount=504

==================================

And in Silesia there was colonization by Frederick the Great:

http://translate.google.com/translate?s ... C5%2584ska

http://translate.google.com/translate?s ... C5%2584ska

That planned action of colonization resulted in 171,000 German settlers coming to Upper Silesia:

In the year 1763 settled in Upper Silesia 61,000, and during the next 40 years, about 110,000 Germans


Despite this large influx (and further during the 1800s), Upper Silesia remained mostly Polish-speaking until the 1900s.
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